4 questions

may · Post by **may** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 3:37 pm

1) Canaries + Finches:
If canaries were included in finchinfo.com's species list, would they be listed as passive, pushy, or aggresive? I've read that you can mix canaries with finches, but have no idea which species could live happily together. Also, do you need to allow for a larger cage to mix canaries with finches? Would you only recommend mixing them if you have an aviary? Would a 36x18x18 cage be sufficient for 1 finch and 1 canary?

I haven't had birds before and am considering either finches or canaries and can't decide which, or whether a combination is okay for a beginner.

2) Mixing species, mixing genders:
A rescue group in my area has a female shaft-tale with a male owl finch and they are very happy together. That made me wonder, if you're mixing species should you mix genders to minimize tensions, or does it not matter? Would a male shaft-tale be just as happy with a male owl finch as a female?

3) The issue of cats
Also, I have cats and would rather hang a cage than have it on a stand. Are there cages large enough for 2 birds that can be hung? I don't foresee the cats being a problem -- 1 is 18 and can only jump up to the sofa and the other is loses interest in most things fast -- but I would feel better if the cage couldn't ever be knocked over no matter what.

4) Breeder vs Pet Store
I don't have a car and it's much easier for me to go to a pet store than to a breeder as they all seem to be 1-2 hours outside of the city. Is it a bad idea to buy birds from pet stores? Over the years no matter what store I've been in, the birds always seem over-crowded.

So... those are my initial questions. I'll probably have more!

thank you thank you!

tammieb · Post by **tammieb** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 5:57 pm

Hi May, welcome to the forum.

I'll attempt to answer your questions, but others will come along to offer suggestions/advice also.

1. Canaries are anti-social. You can't keep two canaries together unless it is during breeding season and even then you must be certain they are ready to breed before introducing them. They will become aggressive to any bird they are housed with if there isn't adequate space. A cage the size you mentioned MIGHT be okay for a canary and perhaps a society finch, which seem to get along with most everything. Generally canaries are kept one to a cage though. I have one of my canary hens in a large, 6'l x7'T x 3'D flight cage, with 12 other finches. Perhaps I'm just lucky, but so far they are getting along okay. I would not recommend keeping canaries in a mixed flight smaller than the size I mentioned.

2. Most finches are social birds and need companions. It they don't have a friend of the same type, they will bond with another species. I don't think it matters much if you keep same gender birds of differing species so long as you have two species that are compatible. Check the species compatibility chart on finchinfo.com

3. I also have a cat. Although he is old and appears to have no interest in the birds, I still keep him away from them. I am able to dedicate one entire room to the birds and have replaced the regular door with a screen door so I am able to hear and see the birds from the rest of the house. Hanging a cage would be better than a stand IMO. If you can suspend the cage where the younger cat can't hop on furniture and then get to the cage you might make it work. If the cat shows any interest in the birds while you are present I would NOT trust the cat alone with the birds. Cats are naturallly attracted to birds so don't fool yourself into thinking that your cat will lose interest anytime soon. You may have to place the birdcage behind a closed door when you are planning on leaving the house.

4. If you are not planning on breeding, then petstore quality birds would suit your needs. Someone has to take the little guys home and love them! I know... we're not suppose to support the pet store business, so it's a matter of personal opinion. Just be certain to have everything set up at home and ready for them when you bring them home and study them carefully before you buy them. Visit as many pet stores as possible and select those that appear to be the healthiest. Don't get sucked into "rescuing" a sick bird.

Post by **Hilary** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:22 pm

May - I've been watching that shaft tail/owl pair on petfinder.com, hoping that somebody would adopt them!

Hilary

may · Post by **may** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:22 pm

Thanks Tammie! I will definitely do either finches or a canary, but not both. I just don't know which. I really hate the idea of keeping just one bird alone in a cage, so maybe a canary is not the way to go for me.

As for the cat, I agree. I think she'd be really good about steering clear of birds while I'm around, but who knows what she'll want to do about them when I go to work. I live in a big single-room loft with high ceilings so for me hanging the cage is the best option.

And since I'm not planning to breed I will start hitting the local pet shops to see what they have. I would adopt the owl/split-tail pair, but the rescue group has a very long string of hoops I'd have to jump through and by the time I do all that I'm sure they'll already be adopted. It's frustrating, because the hoops make so much sense for people wanting to adopt parrots, but a couple of finches are just not the same thing as an African Grey that's going to live 85 years, you know?! It would be harder to adopt these two finches than it was for me to adopt my dog from the SPCA, so pet store it is!! About pet stores though... do they generally only carry zebras?

may · Post by **may** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:24 pm

Hilary - I know!! They're beautiful. It just seems impossible though. I emailed that rescue group to ask if all the adoption procedures were the same for finches or budgies as they are for parrots and they didn't even bother to write me back!! Very frustrating...

tammieb · Post by **tammieb** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:36 pm

may wrote: It's frustrating, because the hoops make so much sense for people wanting to adopt parrots, but a couple of finches are just not the same thing as an African Grey that's going to live 85 years, you know?! It would be harder to adopt these two finches than it was for me to adopt my dog from the SPCA, so pet store it is!! About pet stores though... do they generally only carry zebras?

Yes, I understand what you're saying. Sometimes these rescue groups go a bit crazy with the rules and regulations. They believe they have the animal's best interest in mind and don't care who they piss off.

Most of your PetCo or PetSmart type chains carry a variety of finches. It may be hit or miss though if you are looking for a particular type. It's difficult to say when you are dealing with the smaller "mom & pop" stores. Building a relationship with the owner could be to your advantage as they might call you when/if they get something in out of the ordinary.

Do you have a certain type of finch in mind?

tammieb · Post by **tammieb** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:48 pm

Is this the shaft-tail and owl you were talking about?

In the pet notes it says to call for more info. Perhaps they don't respond to emails??

Side note: This same rescue, http://www.petfinder.org/shelters/BC130.html also has a star finch,Beautiful bird!!

which is a docile type and would do well with the shaft-tail and owl. You could start your own little collection of finches! ;)

may · Post by **may** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 6:57 pm

I'm not entirely sure what species is best, and maybe you might have some ideas. I think it comes down to their personalities and their song. I'd either like a bird with a lovely little song, or one that's quite quiet. Not mute or anything though! I'd just prefer to not live with a persistant the squwacking by brother's parrotlets are capable of. I want to feel relaxed having them near me and I also want to laugh at their antics. So I'd like a bird that is social and and at times comical and that has a soft relaxing sound to it. When I saw the owl/split-tail pair I read up on those species and it seems like they fit the bill.

As for that rescue group, I guess if they're turning away potential bird owners, at least the birds are happy and well cared for now and aren't in desperate and immediate need of new homes. They're probably more than happy in their foster homes.

When I found my dog at the pound a couple of years ago they had some finches so maybe I'll head over there for a look too.

tammieb · Post by **tammieb** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 7:00 pm

May,

I believe I may have added to my earlier post since you read it. I would go after the birds at the bird sanctuary if I were you. I have not personally heard a star finch, but from what I've read they have a pleasant & quite song. The shaft-tails are also quite, as are the owls.

may · Post by **may** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 7:01 pm

I know! I've been keeping my eye on those three. I tried calling but the answering machine said to email! I will try again.

tammieb · Post by **tammieb** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 7:05 pm

Weird, that they would say to call in the pet notes then tell you to email when you do call. Keep after it, that way they will know you are serious about wanting them.

Good Luck!

may · Post by **may** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 7:14 pm

It is pretty odd, but I'll just keep hitting them with emails until I hear back. I gave my subject line something much more specific this time so hopefully it jumps out at them in their inbox.

Do you think it would be okay to have those 3 finches together? I thought I read somewhere that it's better to have either 2 birds, or 6 or more, but if there are 3 the most submissive one will get picked on. That happened at my house when I found a stray cat in my back alley and had 3 for a while anyway!

If I had 3 finches, the cage would have to be bigger. I wonder if there's a point where a cage is just to big to be hung?

Post by **Hilary** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 7:41 pm

Those are the ones! That's a shame that they're making it so hard - the birds have been there for months.

Hilary

may · Post by **may** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 8:03 pm

awww, have they really? the star finch is probably bored and lonely all by herself. it's strange that they haven't already moved her in with the other two. maybe they don't get along. hopefully i hear back from them!

tammieb · Post by **tammieb** » Sun Apr 30, 2006 9:40 pm

Three finches would be the maximum that your 36x18x18 cage could hold. And it is true that keeping an odd number of birds is normally not a good idea. Owls and stars are generally known as passive birds, while the shaft-tail can be somewhat pushy. Also, the owl and shaft-tail are already friends, so there may be an adjustment period for the trio. One other thing to consider is that owls and stars have been known to breed. And since the pet notes indicate the owl is male and the star is female, inter-breeding is certainly a possibility and something to be avoided.

I personally feel it would be worth it to get all three and attempt to house them together. Of course you know what's best for your situation. Don't get in over your head, it's easy to do.

Whatever you decide, be sure to keep us posted.