Zebras were fine in smaller cage, got bigger one, now fight!

[needfinchhelp]

Hello! New here, and need some help.

Bought two zebra finches (for the life of me, can't tell what gender), who got along fine for the first few weeks/month in their original small cage. Snuggling, pruning each other, very happy. Reading up on more appropriate size cages for them, I got the 30 x 18 x 18 to give them more room. I also got them some toys, and a larger nest.

I'm thinking the toys are the issue, but not sure. Now, they chase each other around, and hiss at each other, staring each other down, and opening their beaks. They are equal opportunity chasers - it's not just one chasing the other, they both are the aggressors.

They were VERY confused about the larger nest, and didn't seem to like it, so I took it out, and put the smaller one back in. They both go into it at night, and sleep together peacefully. But when awake, they chase each other around a lot. It is difficult to tell why.

When I first got them, they were doing what appeared to be mating every morning, but there are no fruits of their labor. Thus, I assumed they were opposite sex. But based on the markings and what I have read, they are very similar in appearance.

Can someone tell me please why they are now fighting, and what if anything I should do about it? They have not grabbed each other or hurt each other, it's just chasing, but they do it a lot. Thanks in advance for any help or advice!

[Finchgirl]

If they are very similar in appearance, and no eggs have ever been layed (even infertile ones) then yes, they are probably both male. They are most likely fighting over the new territory in the larger cage. To stop this, you could start by adding another nest box so each finch gets its own box. If you post pictures of your finches, or give links to pictures of what you think your finches look like I can help determine what gender they are.

[6finchfriends]

Zebras have scrappy personalities so it it's two males they are probably trying to chase the other one away. Two males will still do a mating dance and jump on the other ones back. A lot of the time it's not mating but a show of dominance. Hope things settle down for you and them!

[needfinchhelp]

Thanks very much for the info on what appeared to be mating behavior. I have hopefully attached the closest photo I found of what they look like. The one I have been calling the male looks just like the photo. The other one looks just like that as well, only the one I have been calling the female does not have the black bar across the front of the chest. That missing black bar is the only difference in their appearance. Same sex?

http://palaeo.gly.bris.ac.uk/melanosome ... ipitus.jpg

[L in Ontario]

I have approved your post with the photo. However if the photo is not yours - we will need either:
> a link to the corresponding website - instead of the photo, or
> we will need to see written permission from the owner/creator of the photo.

Otherwise, to copy/paste photos from the internet is a contradiction of internet copyright laws and we will have to remove it.

If you can provide us with the URL link to the website where the photo originated then one of the mods / admins can go in to your message and swap the link for the photo.

Thanks!

[needfinchhelp]

I have approved your post with the photo. However if the photo is not yours - we will need either:
> a link to the corresponding website - instead of the photo, or
> we will need to see written permission from the owner/creator of the photo.

Otherwise, to copy/paste photos from the internet is a contradiction of internet copyright laws and we will have to remove it.

If you can provide us with the URL link to the website where the photo originated then one of the mods / admins can go in to your message and swap the link for the photo.

Thanks!

Ok, sorry, I didn't know. Here is a link to where I found the photo:

http://palaeo.gly.bris.ac.uk/melanosomes/news.html

I just googled images for zebra finches, and this photo was the closest I could find. You just have to scroll down to find the photo of the finch.

Thanks!

[Ria]

well, if both your birds look like the pic, you've got two boys. females don't have the black chest bar, orange cheeks or spots on the sides. Zebras are notorious for squabbling; now that the cage is big enough for the birds to have their own space, they are going to fight over it! if you haven't already done so, an extra nest (at the same height) is definitely a good idea. also, try removing any toys with mirrors on them. they might mistake the reflection for another real bird, getting them more upset.

[needfinchhelp]

Interesting.....would it matter if one nest is bigger than the other? And should I assume that the nests should not be right next to each other?

[ac12]

I would remove the nest, and anything that looks like it could be used as a nest. This is to remove anything that could trigger them to go into breeding mood. Besides, they do not need a nest to sleep in, they will sleep perfectly fine on a perch.

You want to have a high perch on both ends of the cage at the SAME height. Or they may squable over getting the highest perch.

Something that I found interesting and similar to what you are experiencing, is when I had 2 zebras in a travel cage, for separation or treatment, they got along fine. But when I put them into their larger cage, the aggression came out. Seemed like they had to get along in the smaller cage, so they did. But given more room to be aggressive, they start to "let loose."

Also, I have birds that just do not seem to like each other. Once I remove one from the cage, peace and quiet returns, no more hissing coming from the cage. Juggling the birds to find compatible pairs (same sex) that won't be aggressive to each other can sometimes be tricky. I have sometimes separated them with a wire divider, so they can see each other but not chase. "see but don't touch." After a week or two of this visual separation, they "sometimes" mellow out and get along...and sometimes they don't.

[needfinchhelp]

I would remove the nest, and anything that looks like it could be used as a nest. This is to remove anything that could trigger them to go into breeding mood. Besides, they do not need a nest to sleep in, they will sleep perfectly fine on a perch.

You want to have a high perch on both ends of the cage at the SAME height. Or they may squable over getting the highest perch.

Something that I found interesting and similar to what you are experiencing, is when I had 2 zebras in a travel cage, for separation or treatment, they got along fine. But when I put them into their larger cage, the aggression came out. Seemed like they had to get along in the smaller cage, so they did. But given more room to be aggressive, they start to "let loose."

Also, I have birds that just do not seem to like each other. Once I remove one from the cage, peace and quiet returns, no more hissing coming from the cage. Juggling the birds to find compatible pairs (same sex) that won't be aggressive to each other can sometimes be tricky. I have sometimes separated them with a wire divider, so they can see each other but not chase. "see but don't touch." After a week or two of this visual separation, they "sometimes" mellow out and get along...and sometimes they don't.

That's interesting. I had not thought about the perch thing, but now that you have mentioned it, it makes sense. I do see them looking down upon each other when one is on the high perch and one is on the low perch. We will definitely try the two perches up hight idea. I have heard numerous people say in my searching that separating them for a time may work. I would certainly be willing to try that as well.

I had not thought about the fact that in smaller quarters they are almost forced to get along, but with more room, they have more space to be aggressive. It certainly makes sense.

Thanks so much for all the information.

So to answer my daughter's question, it wouldn't be good idea to add another pair? Is this cage not big enough for that? She thought maybe another pair might help.

[L in Ontario]

I have approved your post with the photo. However if the photo is not yours - we will need either:
> a link to the corresponding website - instead of the photo, or
> we will need to see written permission from the owner/creator of the photo.

Otherwise, to copy/paste photos from the internet is a contradiction of internet copyright laws and we will have to remove it.

If you can provide us with the URL link to the website where the photo originated then one of the mods / admins can go in to your message and swap the link for the photo.

Thanks!

Ok, sorry, I didn't know. Here is a link to where I found the photo:

http://palaeo.gly.bris.ac.uk/melanosomes/news.html

I just googled images for zebra finches, and this photo was the closest I could find. You just have to scroll down to find the photo of the finch.

Thanks!

No problem! That website also provides a link to a larger pic - which is the URL link I placed within your message.

[Finchgirl]

No, I don't think another pair will help because if you get a male-female pair then there will be three males and one female, which would create even more fighting. If you got one more male then the fighting may happen less often, and the finches will live as a community instead of a pair. The only reason this may not be a good solution is the cage size. I entered your cage dimensions in the cage calculator(http://www.finchinfo.com/housing/cage_s ... ulator.php) amd your cage is only large enough for one pair.

[ac12]

NO not 3. Odd numbers have been a problem for me.
2 will pair up as "buddies," the 3rd will be left out and might be picked on by the other 2.