I feed my gouldians only Zupreem pellet Avian Maintenance as a sole source of food. It is suppose to have all the minerals and vitamins in it but I want to supplement for more calcuim in their drinking water during the time when they are breeding. I have only been able to find "Lambert Kay Avimin - Liquid mineral supplement for birds" which contains Calcium, Sodium, Zinc, Manganese, Copper and Iodine. I am however diluting it much more than it says on the bottle for supplementation in their water. It says 1:4 dilution for breeding birds and 1:9 dilution for non breeding. I'm doing 1:15 to 1:20 dilution.
For those here using liquid supplements do you think I'm overdoing it with the supplements as their pellets already has minerals in it or am I asking for trouble and may be overdosing my precious goulds?
Calcium and mineral supplements.
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chrischris
- CocoFiber Craftsman
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Sally
- Mod Extraordinaire
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I also use the pellets, and I know the companies say it is a complete feed, but I feed other things as well. I do supplement with calcium during breeding and molting seasons. I have lost or nearly lost hens to egg-binding so don't want to chance it. I just keep a close eye on all the birds--if they are active, eating, bright-eyed, just seem to be enjoying life, I figure they are in good health--if they look ill, overly quiet, then I have to look at my program to see what I am doing wrong. Breeding and molting take a tremendous toll on the birds, so I personally don't believe that continuing with the normal maintenance diet gives them quite enough. This is the first year I've used the pellet diet, so I'll just have to see what results I have.
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rottielover
- Flirty Bird
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Zupreem says that the pellets should be 80-90% of the birds diet.
So, if your bird eats 10 tablespoons of food a day (I'm just picking a random number here), 9 of those should be pellets and 1 should be something else (preferably some sort of "rich" food, like vitamin enriched eggfood, fresh veggies or fruits, etc.
For example, my Avian Vet told us that we can feed our Severe Macaw 1 tablespoon of "special" foods each day, on top of the pellets he consumes. So he'll usually get a grape, or some egg, nutts, etc.
For the finches, I've been going with an all pellet diet for those that are NOT breeding, and ocasionally (once a week or once every other week) they get a "treat" of spray millet, or eggfood ect.
When they are molting (like my Juvie's are doing now), they get a little extra "enriched" eggfood, and extra millet sprays, and I've even started to give a little seed (not too much though, I don't want them switching back to seed after I finally got them to eat the pellets!)
The "pre-breeding" birds I have (pairs in breeding cages getting ready to breed), they have been getting enriched eggfood (about 1/4 teaspoon per bird) every day.
I have no idea how you'd go about calculating the "correct" ammount of a liquid calcuim supllement in the water though...
When I talk about "enriched eggfood" I mean that I use 3 tablespoons of Exact Handfeeding Formula (also made by zupreem) per each large chicken egg. I found that mixing in the handfeeding formula creates a "dryer" more "cumbly" mixture of eggfood that my birds seem to eat more of, rather than the "wet" egg food I used to make (basically the handfeeding formula powder soaks up some of the moisture in the egg itself).
I hope that helps you out.
So, if your bird eats 10 tablespoons of food a day (I'm just picking a random number here), 9 of those should be pellets and 1 should be something else (preferably some sort of "rich" food, like vitamin enriched eggfood, fresh veggies or fruits, etc.
For example, my Avian Vet told us that we can feed our Severe Macaw 1 tablespoon of "special" foods each day, on top of the pellets he consumes. So he'll usually get a grape, or some egg, nutts, etc.
For the finches, I've been going with an all pellet diet for those that are NOT breeding, and ocasionally (once a week or once every other week) they get a "treat" of spray millet, or eggfood ect.
When they are molting (like my Juvie's are doing now), they get a little extra "enriched" eggfood, and extra millet sprays, and I've even started to give a little seed (not too much though, I don't want them switching back to seed after I finally got them to eat the pellets!)
The "pre-breeding" birds I have (pairs in breeding cages getting ready to breed), they have been getting enriched eggfood (about 1/4 teaspoon per bird) every day.
I have no idea how you'd go about calculating the "correct" ammount of a liquid calcuim supllement in the water though...
When I talk about "enriched eggfood" I mean that I use 3 tablespoons of Exact Handfeeding Formula (also made by zupreem) per each large chicken egg. I found that mixing in the handfeeding formula creates a "dryer" more "cumbly" mixture of eggfood that my birds seem to eat more of, rather than the "wet" egg food I used to make (basically the handfeeding formula powder soaks up some of the moisture in the egg itself).
I hope that helps you out.
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Sally
- Mod Extraordinaire
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Rottielover, I know what you mean about the eggfood. Mine always ate the mashed egg, but they go after my eggbread much more. It is drier, and it can stay in the cage all day. I think the birds like a drier food overall.
I just follow the manufacturer's directions on the calcium supplements, and give what they recommend. During breeding, especially, those hens use up so much calcium producing those eggs.
I just follow the manufacturer's directions on the calcium supplements, and give what they recommend. During breeding, especially, those hens use up so much calcium producing those eggs.
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chrischris
- CocoFiber Craftsman
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I emailed Zupreem inregards to this issue and they responded sa such...
"Also, you can add some additional calcium (through Egg shells, etc) during breeding season, but I would caution as to adding any other supplements. Our diets are 100% completely balanced, and by adding additional nutrients it can affect how a birds body absorbs the vitamins and minerals."
So I guess it's ok to do just the Calcium in times of need.
I'm having a hard time finding just liquid Calcium to add in the drinking water. Does anyone have a product in mind where I can get easily from the local pet store?
"Also, you can add some additional calcium (through Egg shells, etc) during breeding season, but I would caution as to adding any other supplements. Our diets are 100% completely balanced, and by adding additional nutrients it can affect how a birds body absorbs the vitamins and minerals."
So I guess it's ok to do just the Calcium in times of need.
I'm having a hard time finding just liquid Calcium to add in the drinking water. Does anyone have a product in mind where I can get easily from the local pet store?
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kiwi & mango
- Persistent Pursuer
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) if I were to buy the egg food cake that I see at petsmart would it be all right to place a wedge in the cage two or three times a day and keep the rest in the fridge. How long does it stay good in the fridge....or is the freezer better.-
Sally
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Sally
- Mod Extraordinaire
- Posts: 17929
- Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:55 pm
- Location: DFW, Texas
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Sally
- Mod Extraordinaire
- Posts: 17929
- Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:55 pm
- Location: DFW, Texas
Sure--I got it from this site:
www.finchaviary.com
Take one dozen eggs, separate yolk from white. Beat the egg whites till like meringue. (I do till soft peaks). Add the yolks and 1 box corn muffin mix (I use Jiffy). Beat just till combined. Spray a 9x13x2 pan well with cooking oil spray. Pour mixture into pan and bake for about 20 minutes at 400 degrees. When cool, cut into squares. Freezes very well. Original recipe calls for 3-4 Tbs. of Kaytee handfeeding formula as well, but I don't even bother with that any more. And I wash the egg shells, put them on a cookie sheet, and when the egg bread comes out of the oven, the shells go in for about 15 minutes at 300 or 350 degrees. Then I put the shells thru the mini chopper and add that to their dish of oystershell grit.
I cut it into 8 portions. When I want some, I thaw out one portion and chop it into crumbs in my mini food chopper. This will do for several days for about 40 finches mostly in breeding cages (and I really could do with even less, as I throw out some every time). For smaller number of birds, you could cut it into 16 squares or even more if you wanted.
To the crumbled egg bread, you can add chopped broccoli, carrots, whatever veggie your birds like, as long as it isn't too wet, like cucumber, or you can mix it with mashed hard-boiled egg or even insectivorous mix for a really high protein food. This will make your batch go even further. This sounds like a lot of work, but it isn't that hard, and when the stores have eggs on sale (like today--99 cents/dozen), I will make up a bunch to put in the freezer. My birds all love it, it is good for them, and since it is drier than mashed egg, it can stay in the cage all day (if you add veggies or mashed egg, you will have to watch it more for spoilage, but I leave it in all day with broccoli in it). Just play with it and see what your birds like.
www.finchaviary.com
Take one dozen eggs, separate yolk from white. Beat the egg whites till like meringue. (I do till soft peaks). Add the yolks and 1 box corn muffin mix (I use Jiffy). Beat just till combined. Spray a 9x13x2 pan well with cooking oil spray. Pour mixture into pan and bake for about 20 minutes at 400 degrees. When cool, cut into squares. Freezes very well. Original recipe calls for 3-4 Tbs. of Kaytee handfeeding formula as well, but I don't even bother with that any more. And I wash the egg shells, put them on a cookie sheet, and when the egg bread comes out of the oven, the shells go in for about 15 minutes at 300 or 350 degrees. Then I put the shells thru the mini chopper and add that to their dish of oystershell grit.
I cut it into 8 portions. When I want some, I thaw out one portion and chop it into crumbs in my mini food chopper. This will do for several days for about 40 finches mostly in breeding cages (and I really could do with even less, as I throw out some every time). For smaller number of birds, you could cut it into 16 squares or even more if you wanted.
To the crumbled egg bread, you can add chopped broccoli, carrots, whatever veggie your birds like, as long as it isn't too wet, like cucumber, or you can mix it with mashed hard-boiled egg or even insectivorous mix for a really high protein food. This will make your batch go even further. This sounds like a lot of work, but it isn't that hard, and when the stores have eggs on sale (like today--99 cents/dozen), I will make up a bunch to put in the freezer. My birds all love it, it is good for them, and since it is drier than mashed egg, it can stay in the cage all day (if you add veggies or mashed egg, you will have to watch it more for spoilage, but I leave it in all day with broccoli in it). Just play with it and see what your birds like.
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rottielover
- Flirty Bird
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- Location: St. Louis MO, USA
hehe-
Sally
- Mod Extraordinaire
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- Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 11:55 pm
- Location: DFW, Texas
Hi, Rottielover--as someone referred to themselves on another forum--Chef to my Birds!
I beat the egg whites first, then just add the muffin mix and egg yolks to the same bowl, just dump it in, and then beat it just enough to combine all ingredients. I tried making it once without separating the eggs, just beating whole eggs and muffin mix together. The bread came out very heavy and dense. It probably doesn't matter to the birds, but I like the way the bread rises some and is lighter and not so dense when done.
I got this recipe from this site: www.finchaviary.com. They show the whole process of making the eggbread in photos, so you can see how they do it. Mine comes out of a 400 degree oven after 20 minutes, and is not quite as dark as theirs looks in the photo. This is a very good site for finch information--always interesting to see what other people do.
My birds really love this, and I love the fact that I can put some in the cages in the morning, and it is fine to stay all day. Even my wild-caught waxbills are starting to sample this, and they have been separated from the domestic birds for the most part, so no one to teach them that this is good food.
Off topic, but if I ever get any more wild-caught birds, once out of quarantine they will go in with some domestic birds who can teach them what is good to eat. It has been hard to get them to accept various foods. And now I have them set up in breeding cages, so don't want to start all over.
I beat the egg whites first, then just add the muffin mix and egg yolks to the same bowl, just dump it in, and then beat it just enough to combine all ingredients. I tried making it once without separating the eggs, just beating whole eggs and muffin mix together. The bread came out very heavy and dense. It probably doesn't matter to the birds, but I like the way the bread rises some and is lighter and not so dense when done.
I got this recipe from this site: www.finchaviary.com. They show the whole process of making the eggbread in photos, so you can see how they do it. Mine comes out of a 400 degree oven after 20 minutes, and is not quite as dark as theirs looks in the photo. This is a very good site for finch information--always interesting to see what other people do.
My birds really love this, and I love the fact that I can put some in the cages in the morning, and it is fine to stay all day. Even my wild-caught waxbills are starting to sample this, and they have been separated from the domestic birds for the most part, so no one to teach them that this is good food.
Off topic, but if I ever get any more wild-caught birds, once out of quarantine they will go in with some domestic birds who can teach them what is good to eat. It has been hard to get them to accept various foods. And now I have them set up in breeding cages, so don't want to start all over.