mealworm exoskeletons - a cause for concern?

[Derk]

Ok - so I was speaking to a lady who has been breeding finches for years. I explained I am fairly new to finches (`4yrs) and just fledged my first babies and am delving into mealworm farming. She warned me to be careful as to how many mealworms I feed. She also said that not all birds will suck out the insides and that if they eat the entire 'worm' including exoskeleton that the birds can get impacted. This is a particular concern with young birds. Has anyone had this problem? Any experience with birds NOT sucking out the insides? Thanks.

[debbie276]

Interesting, can't wait to hear others experiences.

[cindy]

never heard of that but have heard of warnings regarding the head and mouth of the mealies.

[MiaCarter]

I've heard of this before.

I crush up my mealworms (dried) and I noticed they seem to leave the exoskeleton pieces, eating only portions from the inside.

I go through lots of mealworms and we've never had problems. It seems like they know what to eat and what to leave behind.

[Sally]

I feed only the mini size, so I've never had a problem with this. Many of my birds will suck out the insides, but many of them also eat the whole mealworm. Minis are so tiny that I can't see the exoskeleton being a problem with them. Finches prefer the 'white' mealworms, which is the worm just after it has shed the exoskeleton and before it hardens (turning brown), so the mealworm is very soft at this stage.

As far as quantity, I agree on limiting the number of mealworms when not breeding, but when breeding an insectivorous species, they should be given as many mealworms as they want IMO. Even though mealworms are not the absolute best for nutrition, they are the most readily available live food.

[Derk]

cindy
so...the mealies fight back sometimes? Can they actually hurt a chick/adult?

[Derk]

Sally
regarding nutrition - what I found particular interesting during my research is that the exoskeleton contains most of the protein. This makes sense, but how ironic. I had assumed that the availability of extra protein was what signaled reproduction, but it appears it may just be a source of soft food. Thoughts?

I had also read that some people try and feed just the tiny mealies, and the white ones that had just shed their skeleton. What about the pupae. Do finches eat this stage as well? Anyone try?

Unrelated fact - turtle people feed mealies and they have to be careful about exoskeletons as well.

[Derk]

SallyMiaCarterCindy
Based on Elana (lovezebs) results with Strawberries etc, I doubt I will be limiting the number for breeding or feeding babies. I am just going to set aside my slightly squeamish side and sort the guys by hand - or figure out the correct size containers with holes for sifting.

A question about caring for the mealies. I have read when sifting to both keep and throw out the finest particles. I assume the confusion/quandary is because the mealy feces and also the eggs would be contained in this final product. Do you decide by smell whether to keep or toss? Or do you just toss it out, and this is one of the reasons it is best to have several colonies going? How often do you do this thorough cleaning?

And thank-you for the responses.

[wildbird]

Years ago I was told by a very good avian vet not to feed more than 2 or 3 mealworms a day to my English Sparrows. It could cause impaction. I ended up feeding 3 or 4 of the tiny mini mealworms from Grubco and they were fine. He said that mealworms contain needed amino acids. My birds ate the whole worm. Most birds will crush the head of the mealie. If they swallow larger mealworms and don't crush the head, it is possible for the worm to chew through the inside of the bird, I have heard. Never had any problems with mine, and always stayed with mini's. When you clean out the mealworm container, separate the worms with tweezers and discard the contents that they were in. Put fresh food in. I kept mine in toasted wheat germ. Once in a while put a piece of sweet potatoe in for moisture. When that is in, leave them out in room temperature for 24 hours so they can eat, then refrigerate. They lasted for months. If you leave them at room temperature too long, they will start to turn into grubs, then beetles.

[Derk]

wildbird
Thank-you - I had heard about the mealies possibly eating their way out, but I figured that was an old wives tale. I have been reading about the different substrate for food/bedding as well as ways to provide moisture. I am thinking - gulp - of letting them breed so I don't have to keep buying. Why I was asking about the eggs and cleaning.

[debbie276]

Interesting article if you have the time
http://boingboing.net/2013/04/01/dinner ... worms.html

Personally I don't think mealies eat their way out but I have been wrong now and then

[wildbird]

It's not that they would eat their way out, but that they could severly injure the bird if they could chew at all while inside the bird. I've never heard of it happening, but then, if a bird dies, how would anyone know.

[Derk]

debbie276
I found the time. lol I have actually seen a cow like the one described. It really is an odd thing to see and think about. Another strange fact - cows get hardware disease - they eat just about anything in the grass including car batteries and nails etc, so the farmers have them swallow a large magnet. The hardware gets stuck to the magnet in the deep part of the stomach instead of moving to the front of the stomach and piercing through the stomach wall and into the heart - killing the cow. No foolin'.

[Colt]

I believe the vast majority of cases of live feeder "insects" injuring their intended killer occur with reptiles who are over-eager and do not kill the insect before swallowing it. Also this doesn't normally occur with mealworms, but rather superworms, which are much larger...like inches larger... Impaction also occurs with reptiles because most people don't care for them properly and nothing but mealworms will impact them.

Birds tend to kill their prey rather neatly before consumption, so I believe the risk is quite minimal for injury.

[Derk]

Colt
Thanks Colt. I read that some of the big mealies (maybe those are the super worms?) are given hormones so that they don't pupate but just keep growing. Finch people probably don't use these big ones, but I wonder if the hormones are of any concern???