Sick Gouldian maybe egg binding?

[Reebre]

I have a sick girl. At least I think she is a girl. I have attached a picture. She is the bird on the far right. I wonder if she might be egg bound. I have attached a picture of her vent. I noticed yesterday that her vent looked a little messy; whereas, the others had nice laid down feathers. I though maybe it was my imagination. Today, she was puffed up and sitting on a low perch. She did not even try to fly away when I picked her up to take the picture and put her in a hospital cage. I have a heat lamp on her and food and water (shallow) down on the floor for her. We also gently rubbed olive oil on her vent. I could not feel any eggs though but then again I was very gentle. I followed all the directions on the egg binding topic. I tried to find Calcium Plus at 4 different pet shops but no luck. In the process I did discover that two towns over is an exotic animal, avian vet. I even went there for the calcium. But they said that I would have to bring the bird in to see the vet to get the calcium. By that time, it was 4:30 and I was an hour away from home where my bird was.
I am thinking that I may need to take her tomorrow. She is not puffed up anymore. She is pooping and it looks normal. She is drinking and eating. And flys up to a perch and flies to the top of the cage. So now I wonder if she is egg bound. Her vent is still messy looking though. Messy is not an apt description. It is not dirty with poop. The feathers are just all disheveled. Not sure what I should do. I guess I will decide tomorrow. And in the future I will be buying all supplements, antibiotics, treatments etc., online in advance to have on hand before I need it. If anyone has any advice, I would greatly appreciate it.

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[Sally]

That does look like a hen, and the first thing I suspect when a hen is ill is eggbinding. She is not showing the most classic signs--my hens usually are on the floor, almost laying down, wings are droopy, eyes squinty-- but your hen doesn't look like she feels well.

I will try to find the pertinent thread, but a member here (kenny66) told about using a liquid calcium for humans in a pinch. You can get it at a drugstore.

Are these part of the group of finches you got for your school library? And you have lost four of them already? Normally I am not big on taking finches to an avian vet for several reasons--it can be expensive, many avian vets are mostly experienced with the larger birds, and often you wind up spending money and getting no answers to show for it. However, since you have had deaths in this group already, I'd be tempted to try to find out if this hen's illness is related to the other deaths. Of course, the vet won't be able to tell you anything about why the others died, since he didn't see them or get to necropsy them.

You will just have to see how she is in the morning. Do you have a small cage to use as a hospital cage? You can put her in it, cover at least half the cage with a wet (not dripping) towel for humidity, and provide a heat lamp, making sure she can get away from the heat if she gets too warm. But the fact that she is flying up to higher perches, eating, drinking--she wouldn't be doing any of those things if she was still eggbound. I have had hens that exhibited all the classic signs of eggbinding, looked like they were at death's door, and after a drop of calcium and some heat, they would look fine the next morning, and no sign of an egg.

Please keep us posted, and I hope she is doing better in the morning. Liquid calcium is one of those items I consider a must-have if you have any hens, even if you don't plan to breed.

[Sally]

Here is the thread where the subject of using human liquid calcium came up. Kenny66 started talking about it on page 2.

http://www.finchforum.com/viewtopic.php ... id+calcium

[Reebre]

Thank you Sally so much for the advice. I read Kenny's post and will head to the pharmacy tomorrow. The picture of her with the other birds was 2 weeks ago and she was fine then. And yes, this is one of my library finches. I got them the Monday before 4th of July. Everyone else is very healthy and happy except the orange cheeked - she or he needs another orange cheeked friend. The gouldians don't seem to care to much for him or her.
I do have her in a hospital cage and have a dry towel over the front of the cage. I will go and dampen in a minute. I also have a lamp over her. Before I brought her home she was puffed up and looked really sleepy. And she let me pick her up.
I am eager for tomorrow to get here so I can get the liquid calcium. Again thanks for alerting me to the thread about calcium.

[dan78]

Hi reebre its not good that you have a sick bird. Well unfortunately the picture of the vent wasn't a very good shot for me to see. Yes if that's the bird in the other photos its a hen for sure. Sally is correct in saying if she was eggbound she would be showing more signs however a hen that is just starting to get eggbound will have fewer signs. The thing that's getting me is she has a dirty vent but poop looks normal so this would lead me to believe that she is eggbound with another disease cocci her vent would be dirty,wet and her poop would be sloppy. For now I would leave her in the hospital cage calcium won't hurt and if at all possible add some cod liver oil to the seed, this will help with allowing her to pass the egg. If or when anyother symptoms come then let us know.

[Reebre]

She finally laid the egg. She seems in much better spirits. She is eating, drinking and perched on a small branch right now. She keeps flying to the top of the cage wanting out. I have started her on the calcium as well. How long should I leave her in the hospital cage? If she should be in it more than a couple of days, I will get a larger cage to put her in. Also, is the egg viable? Should I pull it out of the cage?

[L in Ontario]

Glad to hear she finally laid it! If she's been with a male - then yes it should be viable. I would keep her in the hospital cage overnight and tomorrow put her back in her usual cage IF she appears her usual alert and active self. Keep her on the calcium supplement for another day and then cut back to twice a week until the chicks are fledged.

Others may suggest a different liquid calcium schedule.

[Reebre]

The egg broke when we tried to pick it up. It was obviously very fragile. I am just glad that it did not burst inside of her. From what I have read, that could have been life threatening. I will not be able to put her in her regular cage until Monday because no one is at school over the weekend. I could probably call someone to let me in though if I needed too. But then I would be nervous that I couldn't keep an eye on her. I am loving the birds and will even more so once I am around them daily all day long, but I am discovering that they are a lot of work. I am exhausted. And I have 6 dogs and 5 cats, so I know the dedication and hard work it takes to be a responsible pet owner. It will get easier hopefully, maybe when I chill out a little bit. I have been nervous and worried about them. But I am getting a quick education and this forum has been a wealth of information.

[L in Ontario]

You're right, you do need to keep an eye on her for the next few days. I did't realize her normal cage wasn't in you immediate location. Best to keep her where you can keep an eye on her.

[Sally]

So glad to hear she has passed the egg--so it was eggbinding. It is best to keep her at home for the weekend, as you will need to watch her to make sure she doesn't do this again in the next day or so. The workload will get easier with time as you get more used to it and comfortable/more relaxed with the birds. You had a rough start with them, so you are more stressed than most new owners.

Liz has given you a good schedule for the calcium supplement, which will help her keep from doing this again. I would also get a bird liquid calcium, I think the human kind is mostly good for an emergency when you don't have the bird product on hand.

[tinysparrow]

I know the dedication and hard work it takes to be a responsible pet owner. It will get easier hopefully, maybe when I chill out a little bit. I have been nervous and worried about them.

hi reebre, i just wanted to encourage you and let you know that you are doing a really good job with them!

[dan78]

Hi reebre I'm glad it was a mild case, with her in your care for a couple of days I would and give her a couple of doses as this wasn't a bad case, I have seen a hen alot worse for wear than you explained. With all eggbound hens I usually leave them in a hospital cage for a few days and relocate them to a larger cage when I can. With the egg I usually toss them because most aren't any good soft shell, to large or even odd shaped.

[lovemyfinch]

Glad she passed the egg Eggbinding can be stressful on even the most seasoned bird owner

[Reebre]

Chloe (my finch who was eggbound) did wonderfully over the weekend. My Mom lives with us, so Chloe stayed in her room all weekend. I could hear my Mom singing to her all the time. And my Mom would go right up to the cage singing and Chloe would come up to the edge almost nose to nose with her. It was cute.
I took her back to school today. When I left, she was puffed up. She was preening herself too. I am hoping that her puffiness was from adjusting back to her aviary. It is not too cold in the library (74) so I know it isn't that she is cold. I do have a bully male gouldian. He chases everyone. He is usually not so bullyish but today he was on a roll. So that could have been the cause of her anxiety. I am a little worried that she may be the only female with 5 males. My orange cheeked is a male too I think because he was singing. I will take pictures soon and hopefully someone will be able to tell me. I have 2 with white chests but have only heard one sing. The others have bright purple chests although one is a little lighter purple but not nearly as light colored as Chloes and from what I have read the bright purple chests are usually males.
Anyway, I am heading back to school in an hour to check on her. And I will be there all day tomorrow to check on her too. Thanks again for all the help.

[Jasmin]

Very happy she's ok
Speaking from experience, I'd say 5 males and 1 female in one cage is not the best combo...
I had 2 males with one hen and they fought over her and with her.... Poor girl had quite a few feathers missing from her head. I had to separate them.
Wishing her the best let us know how things pan out