Plucking feathers off the other bird's neck

[Lagirl277]

Hi,
I have two zebra finches: a boy we found outside and then a female we got for him so he is not lonely. We've had them for a couple of months. The female is larger than him. She has been plucking feathers off his neck and I see that he has some skin showing on his neck now. She is not aggressive and they sit next to each other and pull feathers out of each other, however, she doesn't have the skin showing. What should I do and is it dangerous for him? It seems that they are grooming each other and he doesn't mind. Also, I am not sure if its relevant but its been a couple of months and there hasn't been any eggs. I wasn't going to breed them, was planning to take the eggs out but we don't have any.

[RockinCanary]

Hi, perhaps you have two males. Do you have any pictures you can post? If they are not being aggressive then I would hazard to guess that they are preening each other.

[Mick M.]

They may be bored
She may be keen to breed and he dont have a clue what's goin on or just not interested
How much room do they have
When you say you found him outside it's possible he has some mite's and that's why he dont mind the preening/plucking
Regards , Mick M.

[cindy]

Most likely it is over preening.

Here is a very good article on different types of plucking and how to possibly avoid it...very helpful.

http://zebrafinchsociety.co.uk/index.ph ... &Itemid=68

"Plucked Necks

This is the type of plucking I least like to encounter as it is quite often indicative of a defenceless and therefore unwell specimen. When zebs socialise they will often preen a fellow bird across the back of the neck and around to under the chin. The bird doing the preening will often be strengthening its social bonding, but I have noticed that in a lot of instances this won't necessarily be the subservient bird. Dominant characters will also preen, especially if they stake a claim to the perch, but after a short preen they then expect some reciprocation and if this is not forthcoming they will tend to give a little nudge by plucking out a feather to get attention. If this attention is not forthcoming because the bird being preened is too weak, it can escalate until the bird is evicted from the perch to a lower one. If the bird isn't weak it will stand its ground until whose perch it is becomes settled by a quick squabble and chase. The weaker birds then proceed to lower perches, but this is often another birds domain and so gets similar treatment until the bald patch emerges and the bird reaches ground zero.If I ever notice this I will remove the bird altogether to a warm isolated cage for observation. Once it I have heard many a dealer and breeder pass such birds off at sales with the banter "that one must be coming into breeding condition as its being pursued by a male, hence the bald patch" - this is complete rubbish as far as I am concerned and has no foundations in truth. Never have a seen any relationship between bald necks and breeding condition, their claims that it is caused by the cockbird "holding on" is rubbish, zebs do not hold on with their beaks when treading hens"

The article also explains what observations the breeder has noticed with tail plucking, head, chast and abdomen plucking.

[Mick M.]

Most likely it is over preening.

Here is a very good article on different types of plucking and how to possibly avoid it...very helpful.

http://zebrafinchsociety.co.uk/index.ph ... &Itemid=68

"Plucked Necks

This is the type of plucking I least like to encounter as it is quite often indicative of a defenceless and therefore unwell specimen. When zebs socialise they will often preen a fellow bird across the back of the neck and around to under the chin. The bird doing the preening will often be strengthening its social bonding, but I have noticed that in a lot of instances this won't necessarily be the subservient bird. Dominant characters will also preen, especially if they stake a claim to the perch, but after a short preen they then expect some reciprocation and if this is not forthcoming they will tend to give a little nudge by plucking out a feather to get attention. If this attention is not forthcoming because the bird being preened is too weak, it can escalate until the bird is evicted from the perch to a lower one. If the bird isn't weak it will stand its ground until whose perch it is becomes settled by a quick squabble and chase. The weaker birds then proceed to lower perches, but this is often another birds domain and so gets similar treatment until the bald patch emerges and the bird reaches ground zero.If I ever notice this I will remove the bird altogether to a warm isolated cage for observation. Once it I have heard many a dealer and breeder pass such birds off at sales with the banter "that one must be coming into breeding condition as its being pursued by a male, hence the bald patch" - this is complete rubbish as far as I am concerned and has no foundations in truth. Never have a seen any relationship between bald necks and breeding condition, their claims that it is caused by the cockbird "holding on" is rubbish, zebs do not hold on with their beaks when treading hens"

The article also explains what observations the breeder has noticed with tail plucking, head, chast and abdomen plucking.

Very comprehensive and excellent post
Kudos to Cindy
Regards , Mick M.

[Jeff McKee]

I love Cindy's post.

If you have a boy and a girl, this normally doesn't happen. But it does happen. A friend showed me a pair last spring. The male had a bald head.

My birds have always plucked back feathers. I tend to get rid of the offenders. One instance I had, I changed the size of a nest, so that both birds would fit comfortably. The male had been plucking the hens back, wanting to sit on the eggs. Room for two solved the dilemma.

Articles also suggest that this may be a sign of inadequate diet. Egg food, boiled eggs, greens - spinach, lettuce, cucumber slices pinned on the side of the cage, carrot bits, sprouted seed... all add protein & vitamins. Some of my lights are spectrum bulbs for vitamin D. These are all potential answers. I believe this to be truer in respect to being successful at rearing young, more than in regard to plucking.

The fact that it's only two birds... well, boys usually house together just fine. Girls usually house together just fine. A boy and a girl usually house together just fine... Mother nature invented squabbling when the number of boys and girls is out of equilibrium.

HEY I WANT THAT HOT CHICK!

I believe, with Zebra's, that plucking generally has to do with dominance. Who's the boss? So... when all else fails, you'll have to ask yourself some questions... your boy is odd in not wanting his woman to sit nicely with him.

[cindy]

Just passing on some good information from a wonder site I refer to often, lots of great articles. If you sit and watch finches at certain times of the day you can see some pretty interesting things going on.

[Lagirl277]

Thank you all for the answers. They are definetely a male and a female. I haven't thought about him having mites. Maybe would be worth to treat them. What are some of the easy ways to treat them? The female is not interested in breeding with him, I don't think. He, sometimes, pesters her, with a piece of hay, like he wants her to do something but she doesn't respond. He is not very aggravating and I don't think he has done it that much. She is definetely the boss. I can't say she is being aggressive towards him. They sit together and pluck each other. I think they enjoy each other's company. I find a lot of feathers on the floor, by the cage. The cage is a good size, lengthwise, for them to fly. The diet..I give them seeds and hard boiled eggs. They are not too interested in fruits and veggies. I tried corn, broccoli, lettuce, carrots. I guess I should move him, just to stop the plucking for a while. I am still at a loss to why. I don't think I can return the female to the store.

[cindy]

the article and link I posted has some very good ideas in it.

[Lagirl277]

The article is good. I don't think it applies, though. They sit on the same perch as friendly as can be, plucking feathers off each other.

[cindy]

Over preening....try this, get a small feathered pillow and open it, give them some to "play" play with, they may be borard, add a swing, give them differnet food to forage through. The preening is done to one bird then is expected to be done to the bird that was giving the preening and then the plucking begins, if all they are doing is preening then try changing up their environment. Give them Silks to play in or roost in.

[Lagirl277]

Thank you all for the answers. I got them a nest and the girl is trying to pass an egg, I think, as I type this. I'll keep an eye on the boy and will put him a different cage if the plucking gets worse.

[Nerien]

I just had this happen also.

We're working on making the big cage for our six zebras. Unfortunately, Frankestorms and snowstorms mean we had to abandon quarantining them in separate cages in the back bedroom and ended up with all six in one cage in the living room where we could maintain heat during the power outage.

They were okay like that for the first week, then somebody or other started getting pushy, then two days ago all hell broke loose and everybody was upset with everybody else. Could see one male sticking to his preferred female throughout it. When hubby came home from work and pulled the cage down from the top of the shelf for me (only place available due to power outage conditions), saw that that female is half bald.

Pulled her out to her own cage. Next morning, (yesterday), cage with 5 birds, 2 female, 3 male, understandably became a war zone. Pulled out the most offending male. Other 4 were peaceful for about an hour, then they were starting up again, so I pulled a female for the single male, and a male for the bald female. So now I have 3 cages with a male-female pair.

Put who I think is the plucking male back in with the bald female. (As long as separating into pairs, set them up the way we may someday breed them, no brother/sister pairs). Figured if he got another female, he might pluck someone else. Hoping now that the group cage stress is gone, he will stop plucking. They are sitting right next to the TV where I can see them and keep watch.

She has laid an occasional egg over the last few weeks. Saw him pluck once, as they sat side by side, then he leaned forward and dropped it, and they both watched it fall to the floor, then looked at it and each other like, "well, that didn't go as planned".

So I'm guessing stress at protecting his girlfriend, and desire to build a nest may have caused him to pluck her head? Not seeing any aggression, rarely seeing anything that might even be a plucking after that fallen feather. Threw a few pieces of orchard grass in there hoping he might like playing with that instead, but haven't seen it.

Now figuring that the big 5 foot tube cage we are making should just be divided into 3 sections, one for each pair, and not even try putting all birds into the big big cage, expect we will see more aggression even with more room, and then I have to catch them all, again, and rebuild the cage to divide it, and .... yeesh.

[Nerien]

Something else interesting I just noticed--

while all together, and prior to that in various combos but not what they have now, these Zebras never bathed. We had a water bath jar in there, they also had water dishes. But they didn't bathe.

Now that they are in separate pair cages, every last one of them has been positively swimming in their water bowls. The rain is just falling down off the shelf all over the room.

I feel bad at the idea that our big 5 x 2 foot cage needs to become three 20" x 2 foot sections, so that they can stay in their pairs, but I think it will be the way to go. They are so much more relaxed in their separated states, and so far all seem happy with the companion I chose for them.

Wondering--since this is a diy project, if we made it 5 feet long by 2 feet deep by only 15 inches high, we could fit two in the same place, one on top of the other. then we could give two pairs 30" x 2 feet wide, and one pair the full 5 feet, probably to the pair we will let breed first, when we do.