Breeding hen suddenly ill--HELP ASAP!

[GouldieFledge]

Please help, need advice immediately!!!

My gouldian hen that's been raising 1 chick with two daddies (you may have read the other thread) seems to have suddenly fallen very ill. Yesterday I noticed she looked a little more tired/ragged that normal--especially around the eye area. I just got in from work and she's on a perch she never rests on, all puffed out and with her head tucked under wing. When she comes around, she'll occasionally do this weird head bob/waver sort of thing. It almost looks like she's drunk.

There have been two other "off" things about her health over the breeding period: a gradual, patchy loss of feathers around the head and a hoarseness in her chirp--I could only attribute this to air sac mites, but I treat my birds for that regularly. Unless dormant air sac mites are taking a toll on her now BECAUSE of another issue acting as the catalyst? The feather loss started happening right after being introduced to males and subsequently breeding; the hoarse chirp, maybe 2-3 weeks ago. Other than this, she's been acting perfectly fine--no lethargy, eating and drinking well, flying about, tending to the chick. I thought maybe the feather loss was a lack of sufficient light, as her diet is very good.

Questions:
Do I move her to a hospital cage, even though that means leaving her baby behind to fend with the males?
Do I treat with antibiotics? I had a free bottle of Enrofloxin sent to me from LadyGouldian when I had placed my 1st ever order.
If I treat with antibiotics, does that mean I should treat the other 3 birds as well? And will that affect the baby with regard to feeding it 2nd-hand antibiotics?

I have a heater blasting on her and I just put some fresh millet spray in the cage--she started eating it immediately with the rest of the crew. I would assume that's promising. But even then she'll pause between eating, sort of waver like she's about to lose her balance, then continue on. Please, any advice!!!

[GouldieFledge]

Images:

[GouldieFledge]

She is now throwing her head around and spewing clear liquid. It looks like she's drowning in her own fluids

[Babs _Owner]

GouldieFledge

Oh dear........Is she gasping and making a clicking noise? I feel helpless. She certainly has a lot of feather loss on the back of her head. How long has she been half bald?

I cannot give you any medical advice. But if that was happening over here I would breathe, and think in two directions.

1. Mother, get her into a hospital cage with warmth and quiet. She cant tend her babies like this. And are the males doing this to her head?? Antibiotics may make her worse if you dont know what she has. Some pedialyte in her water until someone can give you better advice on that than me.

2. You have babies to focus on too. If the "daddies" are not going into the nest and feeding the babies, then you need to see if you can get them under a heat lamp a makeshift nest in a box. If you dont have handformula, I would rush out and get some and give yourself a crash course in mixing up formula, heating it to 90 degrees and feeding those babies. Only do this if the daddy's stop feeding the babies

I have been here in this panic. And if you have to tend those babies you CAN do it.

Others may have better advice than me, but that is what I would do in this situation.

How old are the chicks now?

[GouldieFledge]

Babs

Yes, she does seems to be gasping, or at least making gaping motions with her beak. No clicking though. I will move her right now.

Fortunately, it's just 1 chick, and it's about 17 days old now. The dads are tending to the baby regularly, so hopefully it won't be a problem. I did buy handfeeding formula last week to be prepared in case this last baby was tossed from the nest. No pedialyte though. I mixed some Thrive into the eggfood I just set down.

I suspected at first that the balding was coming from aggressive male behavior, but I have never witnessed it happen. I have seen other forms of aggression from 1 male, but never head plucking. Can't be certain though. Honestly, it looks like her balding became twice as bad overnight, it was not as bad as she looks right now. Her head is also wet from spewing out liquid, so the few feathers that are there are matted and look even thinner.

I feel so bad for her! I don't think she's gonna make it.

[GouldieFledge]

Ah! Is the hospital cage supposed to be in a different room? Her mate is freaking out now, trying to figure out how to get to her and chewing aggressively on the branches with anxiety! Guess I know who the daddy is for sure now.

[Babs _Owner]

Oh lawd, we dont want him to stop feeding.

Yes the hospital cage should be out of earshot of both cages.

You're going to have to put mom back in. If you have an extra heating lamp, I'd put one lower level and one upper.......making sure they can all still get out of the heat if they want to.

She may have to expire in the cage if that is what you are sure will happen. Then you have to be watchful of him continuing to feed the baby.

I would get up early in the morning and make sure she hasnt died on TOP of the baby.

[erine]

I have no advice, but I'm so sorry. I hope she perks up and bounces back.

[GouldieFledge]

She died overnight it's almost relieving, she was heartbreaking to watch suffer like that.

[Babs _Owner]

GouldieFledge

I am so sorry. Are the daddys still feeding??

[Babs _Owner]

GouldieFledge

How are the daddies doing with the little one? If they have lost interest, have you started the handfeeding?

You can look at Debbie's chart and get an idea of how old the baby is and how warm the baby should be kept at given its age.

http://www.finchforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=25357 This link will give you a good guide on judging the chicks age.

Stage of chick's development Temperature of brooder
Newly hatched 92-94°F (33.3-34.4 °C)
Older, but still unfeathered 90-92°F (32.2-33.3 °C)
Pin feathers present 85-90°F (29.4-32.2 °C)
Fully feathered 75-80°F (23.9-26.7 °C)
Weaned Room temperature

[GouldieFledge]

Babs

Thank you. Dad was in the nest when I got home from work, but the chick's crop looks empty. At what point should I step in?

[GouldieFledge]

I'm pretty sure the baby is 18-19 days old. The crop was full this morning if I remember correctly.

[debbie276]

The chick is only a couple days away from fledgling then. When it fledges I would be sure to offer hard boiled eggs and things like soaked seed, sprouted seed and spray millet, all things easy for a chick to eat.
Hopefully the adult is feeding and you will not have to hand feed.
Best of luck

[Babs _Owner]

GouldieFledge

First, check the chick's crops. If the crops are empty, then sit and watch the nest for about an hour.

If the chick is heard begging with no response from the daddies, then would get some formula warmed up and dropper ready.

While the chick is in the nest, stroke its back and see if you can get a feeding response (open mouth). Take the dropper and put a bit in its mouth, let it swallow. Dont force it. Hes almost to fledge and used to eating a little at a time so you can choke him if you push a bunch of formula down his throat.

Try again every 15 minutes. (Unless the dads start feeding again)

Its a double-edged sword. The dads could reject with interference, or they can actually get protective/jealous and restart their engines and get back into feeding if they see you trying to feed.

Its a 50/50. If the dad's dont get on the ball you will have to try and get the baby to take a wee bit of formula every 15 minutes until he finally gets hungry, latches on. Then I would still only give him a 1/2 of a ml. at the MOST at one time til his crops are full

I've fed reluctant chicks (4 of them) and it takes PATIENCE to get them accept the new flavor and new way of feeding. And it takes restraint to not try and fill them up all at once. I almost aspirated one eager chick cause he grabbed the dropper and I let him have a good bit, but his swallow reflex was more for what his parents were feeding. Their parents only spit-up a little bit of food at a time. He ending up with food running out of his nose, and Im lucky hes still alive and didnt inhale the formula.

The first hours you are basically keeping the chick hydrated, getting him used to the new food and creating a willingness to accept it. Since he's so close the fledging I would say 4 feedings a day (if you have to feed) will keep him alive until he weans. Space it out as you wish.