Iverlux SCAT... the usual

[lnlovesorange]

I didn't want to bombard someone elses' thread with my silly questions. I was just reading and it says that Ivermectin (I have Morning Bird Iverlux to treat my new birds as part of my quarantine procedures) I also have scat. I make up a quart of this to treat them, but now I just read that after 7-8 hours in water this medicine is not longer valid? So the first time I dosed them it worked, but If i used that same solution I had made a week before (the only instructions on it are for a quart 1 tspn to 2 cups) no smaller amounts, and 2-3 birds don't drink a quart of water in a week....) Anyhow, my question I guess is with this small amount of birds am I better off treating with the SCAT directly to the skin? And also, does Scat work on Scaly Face/feet & ASM? Sorry guys I know this is a duplicate.... X a thousand EVERYONE asks this... but I'm getting confused reading the old threads... Thanks guys!

[debbie276]

Ivermectin, S76 and Iverlux will loose the potency after 7 or 8 hours so must be made up fresh for each dose.
DIRECTIONS FOR USE:
For individual birds, apply one drop of IVERLUX to the skin of the neck each day for five days OR add ½ teaspoon, (2.5ml), of IVERLUX to one quart, (32ounces) of clean drinking water for small bird flocks (finches, canaries) Repeat for three weeks in a row.
Scaly Face Treatment
Apply undiluted directly to the affected skin using a Q-tip each day for one week (same day that it is added to the drinking water) until all signs of mite have disappeared (recovery varies from 2-8 weeks depending upon the severity of infestation. Usual cure time is 3-4 weeks with mild infestations. Keep away from eyes & nostrils.
Remove all other water sources including greens, fruits and vegetables on the days of treatment.
Remove all drinkers the night before each treatment. Using this technique will prevent the birds from drinking in the morning before you have a chance to place the it in their drinking water.
Mix Fresh each morning. Only mix the amount you will need for the day.
Ivermectin is potent for only 7 to 8 hours once mixed in water.

Moxidectin, Scatt is effective for 21 days
Apply Scatt at a rate of 1 drop per bird. The drops should be applied to an un-feathered part of the skin – location does not matter. Response to the treatment will take a day or two and the birds will recover well.
Vetafarm website says this is the treatment for both ASM and scaly mites.

good luck

[debbie276]

I saw you also wanted info on bumblefoot??
http://www.birdvet.com.au/exotics%20car ... lefoot.htm

Forth picture from the bottom is bumblefoot pretty well advanced. It starts out as a small irritation or cut, swells and gets red.
https://ladygouldian.com/Foot-Problems

[cindy]

Scatt according to my avian vet should be given for 3 doses each dose 14 days apart to cover the cycle of the mites. They are starting to see reoccurrences in using only the one dose method... some think the mites are building a resistance to it.

Same dosing schedule for ivermectin 1%. Our vet said with a large group of birds oral s76 or iverlux can be used but keep in mind the ivermectin can burn, irritate the throat which may cause the birds not to drink as much water... some species do not drink as much water as others to begin with.

Bumble foot usually has either a fungal, staph or bacteria component to it...if brought on by scaly leg the mites burrow into the skin leaving avenues for pathogens to enter. You can use a solution of Hibiclens 4% (buy it at the drug store) it is chlorhexidine 1 tablespoon to a gallon of water... wash the feet and legs in the solution, if the face and head has lost feathers due to scaly beak you can wash the head using a cotton pad or qtip dipped in the solution do not get it in the nostrils. you may need an antibiotic if the mites have caused infection in either/both the feet and/or sinus.

[lnlovesorange]

cindy debbie276 Thanks so much guys. I had the woman that I buy all my supplies from take a look at the new Gouldians.. Not sure if you saw them Cindy, but here is the link to that thread... http://www.finchforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=35065
She deffinitely thought something was going on with the beak (that's what you said Debbie about the beak, and I never even would have seen it, then I started looking around and it seems that the YH does have some issues going on with something around the beak. My question is how do I avoid the eyes and nostrils if it's scaly face? Because where the infected area is, is right around those things... So I'm just wondering about that. I think I will treat topically as for right now for me, that seems to be the better solution where I am only treating 2 birds They are not in the same room as the rest of my flock, however do you recommend that I treat my flock by adding it to the water? as a precaution? Cindy if you wouldn't mind looking at those photos, I'd appreciate it. As I mentioned (it's Terri) she thought something was going on with the beak, and the nostrils.... But she wasn't 100% that it was Scaly Face, she thought some sort of protozoa... Would the Iverlux work for these things?
Ok so as for the bumble foot, as long as I treat for the mites and get rid of them and no sores develop from them, then they should be ok.... I didn't realize that bumblefoot was like a staph infection or an infection from something else. That's helpful to know. I really appreciate this guys (Debbie thank you, I do have the bottle with the instructions, which btw, Your eyes are better than mine because I couldn't read them, they were way to small!!! LOL)I more or less was wanting opinions as to HOW I should treat, if anyone thought one was better than the other, but Cindy mentioned that (and it makes sense) they may not drink if it gives the water a funny flavoring, and if they dont' drink the medicine or enough of it, then they are being treated..... Ok these poor babies... this is really disgusting to me, again, not just because they are my birds, just that people would keep birds in this condition AT ALL, nevermind a breeder to SELL Them it's just disgusting... Anyway, does anyone know where I can go to complain, or write a review about this breeder? Again, you guys are the best, and I really appreciate all of your help. BTW, any other thoughts on the sex of these birds? Seems to me the most common opinion right now is that I got 2 hens.... Thank you again, all of you.. Take care. and I will let you know how everything turns out. Oh one last thing (of course, sorry) do you know how close the birds have to be to pass this to another bird? Like if a bird lands on top of the cage of the infected bird (with Scaly face/feet mites) will that bird get it? Keep in mind I sprayed down the quarantine cage with AIL with all perches, and each bird. Or I had both birds I was quarantining in my room one set (the New Goulds) when they came on one side of the room and the others (socies) about 10 feet away from them in a separate cage. The one I am most worried about though is my P'Let, he is so nosy, he snuck in there when I was trying to get them all set up and landed on the top of thier cage... I'm thinking I should probably treat him too, just to be on the safe side.... Also, can we get these mites? Like could they get on me or any of the kids (neices and nephews) that get near the cage, and hurt them? Thanks!

[cindy]

protozoa can also cause missing facial feathers... run a course of ronex12% or ronivet s 12%

Scaly mites is close contact like in the nest, sleeping next to each other... birds flying on top of the cage likely will not catch this. It is not like feather mites.

As far as complaining about the breeder how log have you had these birds? As I said birds can have this for 6 to 12 months without signs...most do not treat their birds preventatively or do the whole course of treatment and just add the new birds to their flock and things get passed.

Not sure there is anything much can be done to the breeder unless there is complete neglect...mites happen. I do not know the history of your birds but birds can be carriers of parasites/protozoa looking fine when you buy them but the stress of moving breeding will bring the illness out.

Sure you can post clear close up pictures here.

[lnlovesorange]

cindy I don't necessarily want to DO anything to them, I would just like to warn others, I've only had these birds 2 days!!! The pictures (if you looked at them) is from the day I got them, they arrived VIA USPS in a Live animals box, on Tuesday... which is another whole story, they never notified me they were sending them, so I wasn't ready, they were suppose to come today so I could have their Quarantine cage all set up... I had nothing for these poor guys, so the first night they had to stay in a travel cage.... I felt horrible... Yeah, I'm sure there is no way for the breeder to be "punishe" or anything like that, but I wouldn't want this to happen to someonw even knewer to the hobby than I, and who doesn't have all of these medicines already on hand. I mean i checked the website, the FB page, I didn't see any complaints... or issued, the pictures they had were beautiful... Just goes to show.. .Anyway, my point is the photos (if you looked them up) is form the day I took them out of the box, the day I got them... so they looked like this when they shipped them to me, as I don't think this happened overnight... BUT maybe I'm wrong... Thanks again Cindy, you are always Very helpful, I do have the Ronivetl.... I forget what percentage. I was looking more closely at the YH's eyes, just around them, and below it seems to have a strange look to it, like a blackness, and there are not a lot of feathers there (we originally thought maybe she/he? I was told I got a Hen & a cock... but anyway) that I was being sent a Hen & a cock... now I'm not so sure, I emailed the "breeder" asking if I got a Hen & a Cock and they confirmed, but every Gouldy expert I've run into so far seems to think I have 2 females on my hands. Any thoughts on the sexes? Again, I really appreciate it Cindy, I'm actually emailing back & forth with Terri right now to see if there is anything else I should order from her for treatment before she goes away... Thank you, for everything,.
The pictures below are from Tuesday, I took them out of the box, and into the cage, and took these photos.

[debbie276]

protozoa can also cause missing facial feathers... run a course of ronex12% or ronivet s 12%

I don't think they have missing facial feathers.

[debbie276]

Before you really panic I would give them time to settle in and adjust. I'm sure they are not done molting. And honestly who knows how crowded they were at the breeders. Feather thinning could simply be the molt or stress or if they were plucked at the breeders.
I personally don't think everything but the kitchen sink should be thrown at them during quarentine , but that's me. I would start with the mite treatments and see if they don't improve with just high protein foods and a better environment.

[lnlovesorange]

debbie276@debbie276 What do you think, the topical is better? BTW, just got home and read my Iverlux... the directions for topical Are NOT on there... so THANK YOU for that!! I just came on here to refer to your instructions (which I'm sure if i googled or whatever I could have found, but you made my life easier! Thanks. I agree with you I don't want to treat them for seomthing they don't have. You don't think around the YH eyes and beak are actually missing feathers? Great, thanks again for everything. I will quarantine these birds a little longer than I did my last birds Just to be on the safe side. Thanks again!

[debbie276]

Hard to tell in the pictures but it doesn't look like balding as much as a molt or stress to me. I would treat for mites and worms and then while they are in quarantine watch for signs of other things.
They were given to you in such rough shape I would give them a chance to show you what they are all about.
I like Scatt and the fact that it is one treatment and not numerous over 3 weeks.
JMO

[cindy]

Just saw your pictures posted...I would add some vitamins and mineral supplements to their diets.

The feet looks swollen and red in the joints. Often if conditions are not clean or dirty birds can pick up fungals, bacteria on their feet, scratch their faces and spread the bacteria and fungals to the skin on the face/beak... that can cause feather loss. You can do the Hibiclens 4% wash as mentioned earlier % 1 tablespoon to on gallon of water and wipe the feet, the head and top of the beak...dampen a cotton pad or qtip and do arounf the face careful not to get it in the nares. I would around sand perches for now using a smooth surface that you can clean off daily for about a week after you wash the feet. See if that helps.

I would also run a course of Ronex 12% or ronivet S 12% to cover any internal parasites/protozoa, that can cause itchy skin and feather loss around the face. they could be rubbing their faces because they itch from the irritation.

I would still do your 3 doses of topical scatt or ivermectin 1% or the orals s76 or iverlux to cover all your bases.

[lnlovesorange]

I did the topical last night... Aw, those poor birds, They weren't happy about it, I think one of them (the white/gray headed one) I think she tried scratching it all off!!! Again, I wish there was a way to tell them that what I'm doing is to help them!!! Poor things... But I feel in thier case the topical is going to be best, that way I can add other things to the water (like vitamins) I have been giving egg food and sprouted seed (terris') which (of course) They LOVE the sprouted seed... I usualy add stuff to the egg food too, i boil eggs, mash them shell and all, add some egg food powder, bee pollen and usually Guardian angle or Feather fast, in their case I did the feather fast. Thank you. again. Everyone.