Lost 2 Society Finches :(

[Alley]

Hello all,
I'm a bit upset as in 2 days I had 2 Society finches die
One yesterday and then I came home from work today to my other one dead.
Both are from different breeders, but reputable ones, kept on the same diet as my Gouldians and they were both under a year old.
I worry about my 2 pairs of Gouldian's (1 pair has fledglings right now) and what could have caused this.
I feed a really healthy diet to all my birds in fact they eat better than me. All are on a routine air sac mite prevention treatment, I keep their cages extra clean and they get full spectrum lighting.
They were both acting totally normal, eating and looking fine before they died.
Does anyone know what it possibly could be? I feel so bad for the little guys and worried about my other birds.

[lovezebs]

Alley

So sorry to hear about your lost feather babies.

It is almost impossible to know what could have happened. It could be anything from the fumes off new cooking pans, to some new cleanser, to some infection that had set in. Try and think back if there had been anything new in the last few days or weeks; new food, house painting, air conditioning, new products, etc.

Sadly they are so ingenious at keeping their illnesses a secret, that many times we have no way of knowing that there is anything wrong until it's too late.

I hope your other birds remain well.

[Icearstorm]

Alley

Were the societies with the gouldians? If so, I would suspect they had something to do with it. Do the societies have any plucked feathers or injuries? This may indicate that the gouldians were attacking them. Did you see them drinking? The gouldians may have been keeping them away from the water. Or the gouldians may have chased them into the sides of the cage, resulting in concussion without obvious injury.

If not, night fright could also lead to concussion, though it's unlikely that both of them would get death-inducing night fright. The timing seems wrong, as it sounds like they died in the day. Were they by a window in direct sunlight? Heat stroke could kill them, even in a fairly cool climate. Was their water clogged? This could lead to dehydration; this could kill them more quickly when coupled with direct sunlight.

Do you supplement them? Vitamins A, D, E, and K are fat-soluble, and therefore more likely to be overdosed. I'm not sure how long before death symptoms would be present.

Have you used an air ionizer or a Teflon (nonstick) pan recently? These can both kill birds quickly from what I've heard, though Teflon is typically not dangerous unless it has been heated to over 500°F. Avocado is also deadly to many birds.

It's unlikely that illness was the cause, as birds often show minor symptoms a few days before they die.

If you still have the birds' bodies, you could take them to get a necropsy; however, this tends to be costly and often is inconclusive.

[cindy]

birds can carry disease, parasites, viruses for a while and still look healthy..... then suddenly go down or die.... there are ways of telling what has happened but it takes examining droppings, the belly or having a vet look at the bird in a necropsy.... even examining a bird's (babies included) belly that passed recently can tell a lot. Look for red, inflamed areas, white infection, inflamed intestines, dark liver, liver bleeds (means something has gotten to the organ, lining of the liver).


Birds can pick up pathogens from water, the cage bottom, some birds can carry issues and are not taken down right away but "share" their hidden issues with others.... it is also recommended not to house societies with other species unless you know they are clean of the 3 C's.

Birds can also become sick from bacteria and fungals in water... food bits, vitamins in the water (even at room temperature), salivia can all cause issues for a bird. Even in the best of conditions, care birds carrying issues can hold those issues off until stressed, breeding or until their body just can't do it any more. Some show no symptoms and just die. It is instinct not to show illness...also depends on what caused the issue. Droppings can also tell a lot.

If this was environmental your gouldians would also be showing signs.

Dehydration... birds will show signs of dehydration for at least a day or two before passing... the skin becomes darker red, they stand tall, stretched out, eye become squinty, they tend to rock and sway a bit as they stand tall, legs are stiff as standing

Suggest you keep an eye on the gouldians, if anything happens to the young either before or after fledging you may want to consider running preventatives.

Even fresh egg food/veggies left out for longer than 2 hours can cause issues... fungal and bacteria can set in... you can even introduce pathogens to your birds on produce.... careful washing helps with this.

[cindy]

if you have a bird pass, the sooner you preserve the body the better... do not freeze the body it destroys tissue and cells. Wrap the body in paper towels and put it in a zip lock back, push the air out of the bag and keep in the fridge until ready to take to the vet... wrap the bag in a terri cloth towel and place in a cooler with an icepack..... if the bird has been deceased for hours it will be harder to tell what is wrong since tissue starts to break down, blood starts to pool.

Question when you found the birds did you look them over, was the chest thin, keel bone sharp, was the lower belly under the chest caved in, droppings smeared or dirty in the vent area?

did you house the gouldians with the societies?

[Alley]

Hello all,
Thank you for your fast replies.
They are all kept in separate cages in their pairs.
Only thing I can think of possibly being the cause would be either 2 things. I bought a new bag of food. Same kind I always add to their mix, however my 2 Gouldian pairs ate it too. I through it out just incase and contacted the pet store I got it from.
Other could be we are really smokey outside lately as there are wild fires in the province over. I have been keeping the windows closed and haven't heard of any issues from other bird owners doing the same in our bird community. Then yet again our Gouldians are in the same room as them.
Unfortunately I desposed of their bodies as soon as I found them, but helpful to know that can be done in if need be. I was unaware they would test them.
I guess I just feel so bad for the little guys. I know unfortunately death happens, but 2 in 48 hours is suspicious and I worry I did something wrong.
As to all of your suggestions on what it could have been I have ruled those out.
Thank you to everyone that has posted. You are all so helpful and knowledgable and that's something I really value and appreciate:)

[lovezebs]

Alley

I hope your Gouldians stay well.

How long did you have the two Societies?

[Alley]

I had the one for 2 months and the other for a month.
Gouldians are all still doing great thankfully.

[lovezebs]

Alley

Good to hear that the Gouldians are doing well.

I wonder if your Socies might have been sick with something when you bought them.... Did they come from the same place?

Sadly, it's almost impossible to know what might have gone wrong