FINCHforum

My hen had a problem this afternoon. She had been paired with a mate but had not been given a nest, though she had the classic symptoms of being eggbound. On the floor of the cage, puffed, sleepy looking, and breathing hard. I put her in a small hospital cage with heat light, about 90%, gave her a drink of calcium plus and left her alone. (place food, minerals, water in easy reach ) She passed a really large egg with an extra thick bottom. Within 50 minutes she proceeded to eat some of the egg and by this evening she was eating and resting. Hopefully she will be back to her old self in the morning. I will put her out in the planted aviary for a while and let her eat greens and sunbathe

Hope she's feeling better. Is it just my eyes, or is that egg nearly as big as her head?

Best wishes for a full recovery.

Candace,
Thanks for posting the pics...gives me a better idea of what to look for,
as I've never experienced an eggbound hen before.
I hope everything turns out O.K.

Tim

That is a classic photo of an eggbound hen. She has just passed the egg in the first photo. If she had not passed it yet, she could look even worse, with even more droopy wings, head down, eyes closed. It is hard to mistake an eggbound hen once you have seen one--they really look miserable!

Miss Hen is doing much better today. Moved the cage out from under the light and she is perching but she looks and moves awful sore. Still have the calciboost or calcium plus in the water. She is eating lots of eggshell too. Nothing much was lacking in her diet but I am not sure how old she is. I bought her from a pet store 2 years ago. They had 2 female gouldians in a cage. They were there for at least 6 months. I felt bad for them and worked out a deal with the manager for $ 90.00 each if I took both. I knew they deserved a better home. She produced some nice red head and black head, purple breast chicks last year. So the problem could be the age thing or it was a really BIG egg.

Tim, this is why I posted the picture. Hopefully if a newbie can recognize the signs and will move the hen(you can usually reach right in and pick them up) put them under heat and give them humidity(I live in Florida and have her in an outside building with screen door..plenty humid) You could always increase the humidity by putting the hospital cage in the bathroom with a hot shower. Keep the door closed, this helps alot. Anyway I hope that the newbie will recognize the bird is in distress and act to say their hens life. Time is of the essence. Purchase some calium plus or calciboost and have on hand. It is recommended to condition the hen prior to breeding. Also plenty of excercise for the hen. Fat hens get eggbound more often.
Never attempt to breed the hen for awhile after eggbinding . You will most likely have another episode of egg binding.

I am glad she pulled through, not all do. I have never lost a gouldian to this malady but recently I lost a red throat parrot finch. It is most definately an miserable condition.

Hi Candace,

I'm happy to hear the hen made it - very good news indeed.

Can I ask what you give them as their calcium, vitamin D3 supplement? Do you only use the Calcium Plus when you have an egg bound hen to help her pass the egg? I don't use Calcium Plus and have not used it for a few years now and offer mine a mix I've been putting together... the results have been very good. No egg bound hens at all.

Hey Misty,
As you can see this post is a month old. The Hen not only has recovered but is on eggs as we speak. She has done fine and I think the biggest problem was the size of the egg and the really thick bottom it had on it. I had seperated her but she constantly called to her mate and seemed stress so I put them back together. She had another egg on the bottom of the cage without incident so I gave them a nest. They are a happy couple now.
I usually don't give calciboost or calcium plus on a regular basis though I do have 2 large bottles in the fridge. The water here in My part of Florida is naturally high in calcium and they get a good bit of sunshine . Also the fresh greens.
I give a mineral mix (abba brand), to this I add crushed egg shell (baked from the eggs I eat) and the Hatched brand. Also I mix in trace mineral powder, powder kelp, charcoal, and quartz sand. I also mix vitamin fortified zupreem pellets and rowdybush pellets in the seed mix.
I usually don't have a problem with eggbinding.... but on this ocaission I did.
What mix do you offer... I am always looking to improve. Thanks

I don't know enough about the Abba brand to know whether they fortify it with any vitamin D3. It certainly looks like they are getting more than enough of calcium. It is my understanding that too much calcium and vitamin D can be just as bad as not enough either. Too much calcium can cause eggbinding in hens just like not enough calcium can.

I would look and see where they are getting their vitamin D3 and essential fatty acids. Both are important for the birds to consume to absorb the calcium they are taking in and or using on a daily basis.

Below are notes from Michele Faires that I always try to remember.

"The hen may not being be getting enough vitamin D in order to absorb calcium; and the hen may not be getting a sufficient amount of essential fatty acids, protein, and vitamin A -- which also could be contributing to the eggbinding.

The key nutrients that hens need in order to successfully form and pass eggs through the oviduct are: protein, calcium, vitamins A & D, and essential fatty acids."

I offer a mix of eggshells (Hatched), oyster shells, D3, magnesium, zinc and a few other things that don't come to mind at the moment. But also offer sources of essential fatty acids.

Do your birds consume the pellets?

The birds do eat the pellets. Some pick them out and some just save to last. I alway mix pellets with the weaning nestling foods and this gets them accustomed to eating them later in life I think.
Below is the ABBA brands that I use. I mix the finch , canary, treat, european together in different porportions throughout the year. I order it in bulk from New Jersey and store in the freezer. This brand is my favorite but I also feed
Goldenfeast Australian Blend and Higgins small fruit and veggies.

ABBA 1900 Finch Diet

Diet for Finches

Use for pet birds year-round
Guaranteed Analysis
Crude Protein Not Less Than 11.0% Crude Fat Not Less Than 5.0% Crude Fiber Not More Than 8.0% Moisture Maximum 8.0% Ash Maximum 6.0%

Millet Seed, Canary Grass Seed, Oat Groats, Shelled Sunflower Chips, Flax Seed, Sesame Seed, Cracked Corn, Thistle Seed, Ground Mollush Shell, Kibbled Biscuits made with meals: Wheat, Corn, Oat, Rice, Barley, Soy Bean, Buckwheat, Bean; Ground: Peas, Shelled Peanuts, Egg Shell, Brazil Nuts, Cashews, Filberts, Pecans, Walnuts, Almonds, Shelled Pumpkin Seed; Water, Shredded Coconut, Whole Eggs, Bone Meal, Precooked: Fresh Meat, Fresh Poultry Meat, Fresh Fish, Fresh and Dehydrated: Carrots, Dandelion, Chicory, Kale, Grapes, Bananas, Apples, Oranges, Pears, Apricots, Milk; Honey, Corn Syrup Solid, Casein, Salt, Brewers Yeast, Yellow Beta Carotene, Cod Liver Oil, Wheat Germ Oil, Dextrose, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement, Riboflavin Supplement Niacin Supplement, Calcium Pantohenate, Choline Bitartrate, Folic Acid, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex, Pyriodoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamin Hdydrochloride, D-Biotin, Ascorbic Acid Manganese Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Ethylene Diamine Dihydriodide, Cobalt Sulfate, Magnesium Sulfate, Potassium Iodide, Calcium Carbonate, Calcium Propionate added to preserve freshness, Artificial and Natural Color and Flavor.

Abba canary
Canary Grass Seed, Rape Seed, Oat Groats, Shelled Sunflower Seed, Flax Seed, Sesame Seed, Cracked Corn, Ground Mollush Shell, Kibbled Biscuits made with meals: Wheat, Corn, Oat, Rice, Barley, Soy Bean, Buckwheat, Bean; Ground: Peas, Shelled Peanuts, Egg Shell, Brazil Nuts, Cashews, Filberts, Pecans, Walnuts, Almonds, Shelled Pumpkin Seed; Water, Shredded Coconut, Whole Eggs, Bone Meal, Precooked: Fresh Meat, Fresh Poultry Meat, Fresh Fish, Fresh and Dehydrated: Carrots, Dandelion, Chicory, Kale, Grapes, Bananas, Apples, Oranges, Pears, Apricots, Milk; Honey, Corn Syrup Solid, Casein, Salt, Brewers Yeast, Yellow Beta Carotene, Cod Liver Oil, Wheat Germ Oil, Dextrose, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Vitamin E Supplement, Riboflavin Supplement Niacin Supplement, Calcium Pantohenate, Choline Bitartrate, Folic Acid, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex, Pyriodoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamin Hdydrochloride, D-Biotin, Ascorbic Acid Manganese Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Ethylene Diamine Dihydriodide, Cobalt Sulfate, Magnesium Sulfate, Potassium Iodide, Calcium Carbonate, Calcium Propionate added to preserve freshness, Artificial and Natural Color and Flavor.

Ultimate european finch diet


ABBA 3800

ULTIMATE EUROPEAN/FINCH/SISKIN DIET

THE BEST BIRD FOOD FOR A HEALTHY DIET

CRUDE PROTEIN-NOT LESS THAN 15%; CRUDE FAT-NOT LESS THAN 5%

CRUDE FIBER-NOT MORE THAN 12%; MOISTURE (MAX)-10%; ASH (MAX)-6%

INGREDIENTS: NIGER SEED, CANARY GRASS SEED, CANOLA RAPE SEED, WHITE AND BLACK LETTUCE SEED, JAPANESE MILLET SEED, NONVIABLE HEMP SEED, FLAX SEED, SESAME SEED, SHELLED SUNFLOWER SEED, SMALL SUNFLOWER THE SIZE OF RICE, ESPECIALLY GROWN BY ABBA FOR CARDUELAN FINCH MIX, OAT GROATS, POPPY SEED, RYE GRASS SEED, FESCUE GRASS SEED, PERILLA SEED GROWN BY ABBA, GOLD OF PLEASURE SEED, FENNEL SEED, RED CLOVER SEED, CHICORY SEED, BELLA DI NOTTE SEED (MIRABILIS JALAPA, NYCTAGINACEAE) GROWN BY ABBA, WILD SEED GROWN BY ABBA, PARSLEY SEED, GROUND MOLLUSK SHELL; KIBBLED BISCUIT AND EXTRUDED PRODUCT MADE WITH MEALS: WHEAT, CORN, OAT, RICE, BARLEY, SOY BEAN. BUCKWHEAT, BEAN; GROUND: PEAS, SHELLED PEANUTS, EGG SHELL, BRAZIL NUTS, CASHEWS, FILBERTS, PECANS, WALNUTS, ALMONDS, SHELLED PUMPKIN SEED; WATER, SHREDDED COCONUT, WHOLE EGGS, BONE MEAL; PRECOOKED: FRESH MEAT, FRESH POULTRY MEAT, FRESH FISH; FRESH AND DEHYDRATED: CARROTS, DANDELION,& DANDILION SEEDS, CHICORY, KALE, GRAPES, BANANAS, APPLES, ORANGES, PEARS, APRICOTS CHICKWEED & CHICKWEED SEEDS, MILK, HONEY, CORN SYRUP SOLID, CASEIN, SALT, BREWERS YEAST, YELLOW BETA CAROTENE—COD LIVER OIL, WHEAT GERM OIL, DEXTROSE, VITAMIN A SUPPLEMENT, VITAMIN D3 SUPPLEMENT, VITAMIN B12 SUPPLEMENT, VITAMIN E SUPPLEMENT, RIBOFLAVIN SUPPLEMENT, NIACIN SUPPLEMENT, CALCIUM PANTOTHENATE, CHOLINE BITARTRATE, FOLIC ACID, MENADIONE SODIUM BISULFITE COMPLES, PYRIODOXINE HYDROCHLORIDE, THIAMIN HYDROCHLORIDE, d-BIOTIN, ASCORBIC ACID, MANGANESE SULFATE, ZINC SULFATE, FERROUS SULFATE, MAGNESIUM SULFATE, POTASSIUM IODIDE, CALCIUM CARBONATE, CALCIUM PROPIONATE ADDED TO PRESERVE FRESHNESS, ARTIFICIAL AND NATURAL COLOR AND FLAVOR.

Canary/Finch treat




CANARY/FINCH TREAT AND SONG FOOD
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS:

CRUDE PROTEIN – NOT LESS THAN 15%; CRUDE FAT – NOT LESS THAN 5%; CRUDE FIBRE – NOT MORE THAN 12%; MOISTURE (MAX) – 14%; ASH (MAX) – 6%

Ingredients: Thistle Seed, Canary Grass Seed, Millet Seed, Rape Seed, Oat Groats, Flax Seed, Sesame Seed, Shelled Sunflower Seed Chips, Cracked Corn, Peanut Hearts, Lettuce Seed, Anise Seed, Kibbled Biscuits Made With Wheat Meal, Corn Meal, Soy Bean Meal, Bean Meal, Water, Shredded Coconut, Whole Eggs, Bone Meal, Fresh Meat, Fresh Poultry Meat, Fresh and Dehydrated: Carrots, Dandelions, Chicory, Kales, Grapes, Bananas, Apples, Oranges, Pears, Apricots, Fresh Fish, Milk, Honey, Corn Syrup Solid, Casein, Salt, Brewers Yeast, Yellow Beta Carotene, Cod Liver Oil, Wheat Germ Oil, Dextrose Vitamin Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Vitamin B12 Supplement, Riboflavin Supplement, Niacin Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Choline Bitartrate, Folic Acid, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite, Ascorbic Acid, Manganese Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Ferrous Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Ethylene Diamine Supplement, Calcium Carbonate and Calcium Propionate Added To Preserve Freshness, Artificial and Natural Color and Flavor.

Mineral Grit

ABBA MINERAL ESSENTIAL MINERAL GRIT FOR ALL SPECIES OF SEED-EATING BIRDS

GUARANTEED ANALYSIS:

CALCIUM (MAX) – 34% (MIN) – 31%; DISCALCIUM PHOSPHATE (PHOSPHOROUS) (MIN) – 46%; SALT (MAX) – 3.04% (MIN) – 2.04%

Ingredients: Sterilized Oyster Shell, Mollusk Shell, Sterilized Egg Shell, Sea Sand, Charcoal, Refined Bone Meal, Calcium Propionate, Salt, Potassium Iodide, Iron Oxide, Ferrous Carbonate, Copper Sulfate, Copper Oxide, Nickel Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Magnesium Oxide, Manganous Oxide, Calcium Phosphate, Calcium Carbonate, Calcium Periodate, Cobalt Carbonate, Dicalcium Phosphate, Artif

I just went thru this...kinda

My hen was behaving abnormally.
She laid 3 eggs, then on the 4th day no eggs. OK I figure that is it, a 3 egg clutch.
But that evening 15 min before lights out, she went to the cage floor and kinda sat there. She was not ruffled up or looking distressed, but that strange behavior told me something is not right with her.

Sure enough, this morning, she laid one egg in the nest, then she pecked a hole in it and proceeded to eat part of it , then she took the remainder of the egg out of the nest. Then a few minutes later, she laid another egg on the cage floor. I put the egg she laid on the floor into the nest, and they are sitting on 4 eggs.

She must have had the first egg in her for a day, and it was like she was mad at that egg for being stuck, and immediately ate it. I got the video of her pecking and eating her egg on my nestcam. My wife was really upset when she saw the video of her eating her egg.

Has anyone ever had the egg break inside of the hen, it happened to a female parakeet of mine. She was a single bird but once in a while she passed an egg. I came home from work and found the contents of an egg all over her bottom. I called my vet and he said to watch her carefully, but she ended needing medical help. She became ill quickly. I rushed her to my avain vet, he treated her and prescribed a long term dose of anitibiotics. He said she had peritonitis, and was given a second round of meds when she did not recover after the first round.

The vet told me that is is not an easy thing for a little bird to get over and it can and may have damaged her internal organs. She was never the same after that but lived for about a year and half more. The vet treated her with meds off and on during that time, she survived a move from NJ to Florida, meds on board if she needed them.

Thank you for your information on egg bound hens, how to recognize the signs and the steps to take if something happens.

One of my goulds once was bound. You could see the bulge on her belly.
She was on the bottom, eyes closed. I just picked her up without any fight
in her at all.
I had to take her and put a drop of mineral oil on her vent and over about an hour
massagethe egg to a point where I could see it. She would push and her whole body
would shake but could not get it out. By then she was so weak.
When she was actively pushing you would see the tip of the egg.
Then when she relaxed it would go back in so you could not see it.
Finally on one of the contractions I grabbed the egg "tip" with a pair of tweezers,
which pierced the egg. Egg contents came out and I held on to the now much smaller
piece of soft shell and with the next push, it slid right out.
That was one of the wierdest, scariest experiences I ever had.
My husband was like, " "
I was like," "
My kids where like, " "

Exellent surgery..... That was great to get all the shell and contents out. I had a scarlet chested grasskeet once like that with a bit of a prolapse. I tried the same thing simply because it had gotten to the do or die situation. The egg broke and came out but evidently too much of the contents spilled inside and she died quickly. Was sad, I had had her for a long time. I didn't have her set up for breeding so it was a weird situation all the way around.