25 day old gould babies-growth/development ?

[carmena]

I have 3 gould babies that are 25 days old today and only weigh 17 grams a piece. But they seem much smaller than the adults.

One still has flight feathers that are not completely open. The 2 others seem just about fully feathered.
Here come the questions:
When can I take them out of the brooder?
What weight SHOULD they be? (they seem mighty tiny-but I am a handfeeding noob)
I guess my questions all evolve from the fact that at 25 days old I thought they would be bigger by now. I want to know when I can get rid of the brooder and put them in a small cage where they can see the adults.

BTW - I have millet and zupreem in the nest with them

[MLaRue]

Can you provide pictures of them? Zupreem isn't this a pellet?

Are you giving them any eggfood or regular seed besides spray millet?
Are you handfeeding these babies? It will take time to wean them and once they start eating on their own they will put on more weight during this stage. You have them in a brooder? What temps are you keeping them at? They should be at room temps now - depending on what your room temps would be? Mine were kept in a 70 degree range with no problems.

[ac12]

25 days old is just a little older than fledging age, so I would not be too concerned.

At 25 days, they should be at room temperature. My finches are not incubated by the parents about a week or more prior to fledging. They have feathers to provide insulation and they huddle together in the nest providing each other body heat. So they should not need the heat of the brooder. If you are providing heat, you need to GRADUALLY lower the temp to room temperature over several days. The higher the temp, the longer time you will need to lower the temp. Do NOT just turn it off, the temp change would be too much too fast and that could stress out the chicks.

At 25 days old I would provide them soaked millet or seeds. Soaking softens the seed hull so it is easier for them to open the seeds. Pellets might be a bit too hard for them right now, but you could grind the pellets into a coarse powder, or get the LaFebers finch pellets which is much smaller than the Zupreem finch pellets. The smaller pellets or powder would be easier for them to eat.

My gouldians started eating on their own a few days after fledging. But they had their foster parents (society finches) to show them what and how to eat. My zebras on the other hand took a couple weeks to eat on their own. So you just have to let the birds decide when to start eating on their own. First thing the fledging gouldians ate was the hard boilled egg/miracle meal mix, then they went for the soaked seeds. I had the egg mix and soaked seeds in shallow bowls on the cage floor, so it was easy to see and get to.

CAUTION, on the egg food. You should remove the egg after a few hours, so it does not spoil. Don't want the chicks eating spoiled egg, could make them sick. Having said that, I sometimes forget to remove the egg, the egg dries out and seems to be OK. I think room temp and humidity has something to do with if/when the egg food mix will go BAD sitting in the cage.

[carmena]

thanks for all your replies...here are some pics and more info.
The close up shows as of today the feathers still not 100% out. They are today 26 days old.

The temp in the box is about 90. I have them in a travel cage in their brooder/tupperware/heating pad box. The humidity varies. Its in my bathroom so it goes from 50% down to maybe 35% at the lowest. (that is according to my terrible hygrometer! ugh!

The dilute seems to be showing a lot of curiosity today in the scattered zupreem, which is a very small pellet. He plays with it in his mouth and breaks it into smaller pieces but I am not sure if he is eating it. He doesn't beg like the other two...until he sees the syringe! Then he goes nuts too. they all seem to be flapping a bit.

I have a small water bottle in the cage, the exact formula powder in a small "dish" along with some soaked zupreem. The dry zupreem is scattered on the floor and the millet is NOT soaked...but I will do that ASAP.
I am hesitant to place egg in there due to spoilage with the heat from the heating pad. But I gather I should start lowering that temp. My plan is to move them in a small cage with a female society to teach them the ropes but I am unsure when that is possible due to their size, feathering not 100% in, and the temp issue.

[ac12]

With 90F temp in the brooder, I would say you have a ways to get them down to room temperature, presuming that room temp is about 70F or lower. Just turn the heating pad down a "bit" every other day, and keep an eye on the thermometer. They need to "gradually" aclimate their bodies to the lower room temp, before you let them loose in an unheated cage. While they are young and vulnerable, you don't want them to get a chill then get ill.

I do not think the humidity change is as critical as the temp change.

I feed my zebras Zupreem, so I know which one you are using, the canary/finch size. The first time I ground down the pellets, I put some into a metal shot cup and use the back of a butter knife to grind it down. I got a motar and pestal from Cost Plus, and it is a lot easier to grind the pellets.

Are you saying you have the handfeed "powder" in a dish, not the powder mixed with water to make a paste?

You might also try soaked seeds. Just be careful with the seeds. If the seeds have pellets in them, you should get the pellets out before you soak the seeds.

Are they eating the soaked pellets? That I have not tried with my zebras, but might be worth a shot. Since I have to convert the zebras to pellets later, this might be a headstart on the conversion to pellets. Only thing is soaked pellets will be like egg, you have to remove in a few hours, so it won't spoil.

Size and feathering should not be an issue in putting them with a society. Main thing is that they are able to eat on their own, cuz the society finch probably will not/may not adopt and feed a chick at fledgling age. Although you could feed then though the bars of the cage.

BTW, what else is in there with them. I see a foot from another bird on the right of the picture.

gud luk

[carmena]

HAH! That DOES look like a foot...it was just his foot kicked out to the side. The pic cuts out his backside which was out a bit.

The dilute nibbles at the pellets but again, who knows what they eat!

Yes, I put a small bit of the powder solo-no paste...should I remove that?

[GOULDYGIRL]

Carmena, WOW! You did a great Job, they look wonderful!!! Congrat's.

I think they will be fine in a cage right now with a society hen. Keep handfeeding but put the food you have now, plus I'd add a lot of millet spray in different locations, and scatter some seed around as well, or just leave it in a dish with the formula or pellets. The millet is very easy for them to eat and good practice to get them to eat other foods. A society hen will be a good teacher too, especially to try other foods.

So adorable, and best wishes!
Renee

[lovemyfinch]

They are beautiful, congrats

[ac12]

I don't think that I would put the hand feed powder out.
But I do give my finches the hand feed mix; powder + water. They like it when they are feeding hatchlings and nestlings.

[L in Ontario]

Just wondering: why would you put them with a Society hen instead of a Gouldian adult? I would not want them to imprint with the Society.

Great job - they DO look fabulous!

[carmena]

I thank yo all for your advice.
I ended up lowering the temp slowly and put them in with a Gouldian female....who actually is their biological mother.

At first I was going to put one of my unattached female societies in with them because that cage is in the warmer bedroom with the cage of gould males in a flight next to it. But I ended up switching the flight cages also so that the girls and the babies are all in one room. Took some moving about but works out much better.

BTW- they are flying around the room when I feed them like crazy. They are doing great and I am so happy that they seem to be surviving. Now to get them to pay attention to their bird mom and learn to eat!!!!

[CandoAviary]

Congrats again
Whether they pay attention to bird mom or not... they will learn to eat on their own. My hand fed always do. Millet Spray is usually the first seed food they try on their own. something about it is just irrestistable. I also will put down dry comercial egg food and scrape some millet seed onto this.... soon they are on to regular seed and other stuff.

[Sally]

Hulled white millet is another good food for those youngsters. It is usually available at specialty grocery stores like Central Market, or health food stores that carry groceries.

[CandoAviary]

Good point Sally, I buy my hulled white millet from eBird for $64.00 for 50lbs. They always offer free shipping.