Splits or what

[CandoAviary]

History

Grandparents on Cocks side father OH LB/WB YBsf
mother OH PB/?wb YB Grandparents on Hens side father RH/?oh PB/?wb GB
mother BH?/oh PB/? GB

They must of been split because they produced

other Parent cock OH/? bh PB/wb? Lb? YBsf
PARENTS hen OH/BH PB/wb? GB

And they produced this... my first YB WB not sure but I think it is going to be a BH.... never got a white breast from the 1st listed grandparents...only purple or lilac.
I thought this male was going to be a lilac at first because he started getting very light lilac feathers now this


Interesting pattern around a faint purple
His brother is turning out to be the lilac



Question Oh great one...
What do you think the parents are split too
and what do you think the grandparnts are split too
I put in little letters what I was thinking....... or can we even tell with just 2 generations?

[L in Ontario]

Question Oh great one...
What do you think the parents are split too
and what do you think the grandparnts are split too
I put in little letters what I was thinking....... or can we even tell with just 2 generations?

Hmmm I wonder whom she is referring to... Ms T?
It's way over my head.

[nixity]

Question Oh great one...
What do you think the parents are split too
and what do you think the grandparnts are split too
I put in little letters what I was thinking....... or can we even tell with just 2 generations?

Can you give me the genetics of the parents, too? Just seeing the grandparents doesn't help me much - I'm sure you've told me before in another thread but rather than go hunting for it....

PS: The brother looks PB to me, not lilac? Looks way too dark to be lilac.. looks Dilute, even.. though it's hard to tell from them the front, but if he is that means he'd have to be PB.

[CandoAviary]

I do have the parents listed...right under grandparents. I will edit and type parents in capital letters

[nixity]

I'm sorry.. I feel like a doofus, but I'm still confused..
it must be delirium brought on by extreme cabin fever.
Where you typed PARENTS, following that all I see is "Hen..."

Above that I see they produced .. cock
Is that the father, and the HEN is the mother of the babies?

So then it would go..



MOTHER
OH/BH P/?W GB -- Came from:
RH/?OH P/?W GB Cock x BH/?OH P/? GB Hen

FATHER
OH/?BH P/?W SF Yellow -- Came from:
OH L/W SF Yellow Cock x OH P/?W Yellow Hen

And then..
OH/BH P/?W GB Hen + OH/?BH P/?W SF Yellow Cock produced your two babies that you pictured in the thread? The WB and the other?

If so.. they both MUST be /White.

If they are both visually purple breasted, and you got a visually white breasted baby, there is no room for Lilac in that equation.
If one of them was Purple/Lilac and the other Purple/White, you would never see a visually WB baby.

Did I get that right? Or am I messing something up..

[CandoAviary]

Yes... Yes... see this is why I call you are the great one

I went back and edited...wrote other parent but Now I see writing it your way is way more better and a lot less confusing

That is what I had figured... both had to be split for white breast..pat myself on the back
But what confused me was the brother looking like a lilac. He is in the cage with 2 normal BH PB so maybe he just looked lighter purple because the BH are extremly dark purple. Makes sense that he is indeed a PB though. Me thinking he was lilac was really confusing me as I know a purple can't be split for both lilac and white... but that makes me think of this question
hypothetically if
cock is OH PB/LB YB
hen is OH PB/WB YB
Could you get white breast and lilac breast? Or would the lilac be dominate over the WB? So you would get PB/WB. PB/LB, PB and possibly LB?

The other thing that was messing with me was the Mother of this WB chick. I actually have 3 generation on her. She was derived from my origianl normal RH pair. so they must of been split to white also..at least one of them. ..I find it interesting , that being as how I kept all of the original young from that RH pair and paired them to offsprings of the listed cocks grandparents that I had no other white breast. I have had at least 30 chicks from these pairings. So when they threw a WB I was like What the....
It fascinates me to have a bird and after 3 generations and many chicks learn that hey... you are a / for WB.

[debbie276]

You have that the mother is YH/BH.PB/WB.GR - I don't believe that hens can be split for BH

I have had VERY light almost white breasted lilac hens before, could that be a possibility rather then WB?

Whatever they are they're good looking chicks!
Good luck

[nixity]

But what confused me was the brother looking like a lilac.

Well, to me he looks purple

but that makes me think of this question
hypothetically if
cock is OH PB/LB YB
hen is OH PB/WB YB
Could you get white breast and lilac breast? Or would the lilac be dominate over the WB? So you would get PB/WB. PB/LB, PB and possibly LB?

Yes, Lilac is dominant to White

[nixity]

You have that the mother is YH/BH.PB/WB.GR - I don't believe that hens can be split for BH

I was just copying/pasting what was written.. I wasn't sure if the hen was BH YTB and that's what she meant by OH/BH

A hen that is visually OH is genetically red head, with two copies of the orange modifier.
But yeah, hens can never be split for BH.

[CandoAviary]

Yes...I did mean BH ytb ... though thay meant she carried the gene for YH
so how is it that you get YH from pairing a BHytb hen to a YH cock do you get YH?
Doesn't that BHytb carry a yellow head gene?

I thought that was how you could tell the background somewhat. I have some hens YH with rtb and ytb
also have some hens OH with ytb and rtb
I guess I am confused again

[nixity]

so how is it that you get YH from pairing a BHytb hen to a YH cock do you get YH?
Doesn't that BHytb carry a yellow head gene?

A BH YTB bird is genetically OH, it just can't visually express it, but you still see the clues to the birds genetics in the beak color.
So pairing a BH YTB hen to a visually OH cock will produce 100% OH Birds (and all cocks will be OH/BH) unless the cock is /BH.. in which case you will also get more BH YTB birds.

I have some hens YH with rtb and ytb
also have some hens OH with ytb and rtb
I guess I am confused again

Genetic OH can not produce red pigment AT ALL anywhere in the head/beak - so a genetic OH can't ever, ever have a red tipped beak. It will always be yellow/orange.

Likewise, a RH bird will never have a yellow/orange colored beak - it will always be red.

The only head color that can show BOTH beak colors is Black. A BH bird with a red beak means that it has the capability of producing red pigment. A BH bird with an orange beak means that it has the capability of producing orange pigment, and can not produce red pigment.

[CandoAviary]

Got it...Thank you.....