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Does anyone know for sure if I breed a normal Shaftail male with a Creamino Shaftail hen - will the male offspring all be "split to Creamino"?

Thanks!

L in Ontario wrote:Does anyone know for sure if I breed a normal Shaftail male with a Creamino Shaftail hen - will the male offspring all be "split to Creamino"?

Thanks!

Liz.... I may be wrong, but I think the male has to be split to cream.
Hopefully Misty will see this and post soon as she knows the answer to this question.

Thanks Donna. I think you are right - the dad must be split to creamino in order to have the male offspring be either visibly Creamino or split to creamino.

Unlike the Gouldians - when you pair a normal male with a split to blue hen, you could get some males split to blue as well.

Misty...?

Liz, not to take away from your original question...but how are the beak colors on your shaftails? Are the beaks still a pink skin tone color. All my offspring have been though heavy molt, 3 have very deep red beaks one very light orange and the 5th is still pinkish but now I am seeing very faint orange lines in the color.

If the genetics are sex-linked, then a normal male with a creamino hen should produce split/creamino males and normal females. So all the babies will look normal, and you'll have to sex them to know which ones are split/creamino keepers! I just don't know if this gene is sex-linked in Shaft-tails.

Shaft tail genetics and mutations site.... good info

http://www.birdbazaar.com/BB-ColorGenetics.htm

Very nice Candace....thank you!

For genetically and scientifically disabled persons as I - why can't it be in plain English Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!

Is there a translator in the house?

Now that my eyes are crossed Liz I believe that it is saying that all males will be split and the females are normal.

Yes, Liz, that site says creamino is a sex-linked gene in Shaft-tails, really much easier than trying to figure out Gouldian genetics!

Your normal male paired with a creamino hen will produce:
100% normal males split/creamino
100% normal hens

Then if you take one of those split/creamino males and pair it with a different creamino hen, you will get:
50% creamino males
50% normal split/creamino males
50% normal hens
50% creamino hens

Or, if you take one of those split/creamino males and pair it with a normal hen, you will get:
50% normal males
50% normal split/creamino males
50% normal hens
50% creamino hens

Once you have a male creamino, you can pair it with a normal hen and you will get:
100% normal split/creamino males
100% creamino hens

The last combination is creamino male with creamino hen, you get:
100% creamino males
100% creamino hens
This pairing is the only one where you will get all creamino babies, but it is also the least desirable, as the babies can go down in size, color, health, etc.

Don't get hung up on the percentages, they refer to the average of a huge number of pairings, just used to give you an idea of what you may expect. For example, my pairing of normal split/fawn male with fawn hen produced two babies, both fawns (sex unknown at this time). I could have had normal split/fawn male babies and normal hen babies too if I'd had a large clutch.

Each combination will produce babies that will be easy to figure out, except for the normal split/creamino male with a normal hen. There you will get males that are normal and males that are normal split/creamino, and there will be no visual clue as to which is which. All you can do then is breed them and their results will tell you what they are!

Remember:
Males can be normal, normal split/creamino, or creamino
Hens can only be normal or creamino, there is no such thing as a split in a hen when it is a sex-linked mutation.

This was all researched and explained to me by rayray, when I was confused as to what to expect with the fawn Owls.

Just wanted to say a BIG thank you to Sally for posting all that information - it certainly does straighten things out for me.

I currently have the opportunity to get a just-weaned creamino male or female and I'm debating on which one to go for.

Liz. this is another site to reference also..you can write to them and they write back with answers. I have used them in regards to the pink bills on mine....


http://www.birdbazaar.com/BB-ColorMutations.htm

Thanks for the link... and I'm curious - what did they say about the pink bills on your Shafts, Cindy?

They were very much interested in them and actually wrote me to find out about the young which are about 6 to 8 months old, I sent pictures and a flollow up letter to them...I lost their dad in August so not sure how the pairing with any of the offspring with a new unrelated shaftail I have will turn out. There are two female offspring with very pale pink/peach beaks.

L in Ontario wrote: I currently have the opportunity to get a just-weaned creamino male or female and I'm debating on which one to go for.

Get them both!!! It is very difficult to find or raise the cream shaftails. I have NEVER seen any at a bird mart.
My male is normal (Falco) but split to cream. Carmella is cream (the hen) They had two fertile eggs and both were cream. THe society finches are doing a good job feeding and caring for them so if this continues I will FINALLy have some more creams, but they will be related....