Lots and lots of Gouldian eggs....

[Stormy]

Hello All!

3 pairs successfully incubating this season. Last weekend, however, discovered 1 pair tossing their chicks. Peeked inside the nest and there were 12 eggs in there! At least 10 were viable. So not sure but thinking this pair is young, inexperienced, and clearly enthusiastic.

Unfortunately, didn't want any more chicks tossed, so moved them to a smaller cage where, if a chick was tossed, it stood a greater chance of surviving and I could put it back in the nest and remove the male. However, with this disturbance, both came off the nest.

So I took 10 of the 12 eggs (2 looked empty) and placed them in another pair's nest - this pair seems very responsible. But they already had 4 of their own! So now they are incubating 14 eggs. I know. Unbelievable.

My question: the foster eggs were clearly at different stages of development. 2 looked as if they will hatch within days. Others will take longer. What is going to happen when those start hatching at very irregular intervals? Will my foster mom feed the chicks as they come and also keep incubating the rest of the eggs?

Whew. Any advice welcome. Except, I'm really not in a position to hand feed or hand incubate. But at this point, let me know what you think.

Thank you!

[wilkifam]

You might think about getting some Societies as fosters. That seems like way too many eggs to expect any pair to take care of.

[Stormy]

Well, ideally, yes. I don't really want Societies (though I've read they make good foster parents). Don't have room and really, don't have time now to get them set up.

It IS a lot of eggs. My thought was, even if I manage to save a few it will be worthwhile. Can't imagine 1 pair raising 14.

But again my question: those eggs were at different stages of development when I moved them. If 2 of them hatch now, and a few more in a week, and a few more in another week...will the Goulds make it work?

Anyone have experience with this in the past?

[wilkifam]

I don't have any experience with this, sorry. All my clutches seem to hatch on the same day or a day apart.

[Smurf]

It's very unlikely that a pair will be able to sit correctly on that many eggs, you might end up with none hatching.

[wilkifam]

It's very unlikely that a pair will be able to sit correctly on that many eggs, you might end up with none hatching.

I agree. Better to get rid of some of the eggs and give remaining ones a better chance.

[Stormy]

Friends,

This morning the pair came off the nest and I took a quick peek and it looks like a couple of those eggs that were well-developed when I slipped them in last weekend are moving around and getting ready to hatch. My pair are hopping around outside, getting in for what appear to be periodic checks, then coming back out.

So, the saga continues.

The issue here is, of course, what will become of the other eggs. Once she starts caring for hatched chicks, will the others stand a chance?

I'm going to be optimistic. Reason is, the other hen just kept laying eggs, and really wasn't properly caring for any of them, and somehow they kept warm, and were hatching intermittently. (2 tossed, and 2 that hatched but were buried in the nesting material as she just kept laying eggs.) So its possible that without meticulous turning and brooding they still hatch.

Kind of interesting to see how this all unfolds. I'll keep you updated.

Thanks for the input!

[wilkifam]

Best of luck with it all! You might want to be prepared to hand feed.

[Stormy]

No way. Just can't do it. If they make it they make it, if they don't there will be other eggs. I actually do have a lot of faith in this pair - they are older, they don't seem to care about the nest checks, and they are SO diligent.

They were off the nest today most of the day, but totally watching and periodically getting back in there and shifting the eggs around. I was concerned the eggs would get cold, so put a strong heat lamp over it all.

I could see 1 chick moving around in the shell, but as of tonight, no sign of emerging.

And just a bit ago, when I shut off the light, the hen got back in the nest and it looks like she's going to stay in there tonight which is great! See, they just seem very responsible. Lets hope that carries through all the way to fledgling and beyond.

It's getting a bit nuts here - I also have a pair of African Silverbills, and I just discovered today they have chicks in their nest. Not something I ever intended.

What in the WORLD will I do with all these birdlets?

Stay tuned...

[wilkifam]

No way. Just can't do it. If they make it they make it

I totally understand. I have tried handfeeding, and have had very little success.

[Stormy]

So this morning the pair weren't quite as excited. Hen slept in all night, but after she came out this morning I looked in to see what was happening. Was able to tell 3 more of the eggs were not viable, and they had tossed one of their own volition, so they are down to 10. Those 10 look alive. Although, I think it will be a miracle at this point, as they are incubating only sporadically.

This is the first year I tried any of this, so lots of learning here. And there is still plenty of time for them to pull off another clutch.

Thank you for all the input and support.

[Sally]

No way. Just can't do it. If they make it they make it

I totally understand. I have tried handfeeding, and have had very little success.

Agreed. It is not for everyone, and it takes so much time and commitment that most finch breeders don't do it. It often leads to heartache.

[KarenB]

I'm the same way with my tosslings, although usually if I find one tossed, it's already dead. There have been a couple instances where they were still alive. Most of those were in the African flight from my cordon bleus, and most recently my firefinches (their first clutch of five, all tossed).

I have a job that takes a lot of my time during the week, so there's no way hand feeding is even an option for me, and even if it was, I cannot stay up around the clock to feed. I'm too old for that. My motto has always been to let nature take its own course.

BUT, I did manage to save one of my society babies, whom I believe may have been knocked out or fell out, not tossed. I came home from a bird mart out of town to discover a cold, lifeless looking baby on the floor of the cage. My heart sank. I reached in to pick it up, and it moved some. Just in time to save it, I warmed it in my hand, put it on a heating pad and it came back to life and began begging. I fed it formula. It was only one or two days old at that point. I put it back in the nest, and now it's a couple weeks old and doing very well, eyes opened the other day. I am proud that I saved it, but it's my only success in that area that I've had so far. It's hard work.

[Colt]

Handfeeding finches/softbills can be very difficult. They are just so tiny and their metabolisms so quick.

On the note of 14 eggs under one pair...(which I see is down to 10) I would advise not letting one pair attempt to set on that many. I mistakenly paired two hens earlier in the year and they regularly sat on clutches of 15... :/ Of course nothing hatched but they couldn't cover all the eggs.

In regards to Gouldians and staggered hatchings... I wouldn't advise that either. It's very hard on younger chicks that hatch later on as their siblings are going to be older, louder, stronger, and out compete them for food. From a survival standpoint (passing on their genes and all that) the parents are going to focus all their efforts on the strongest chicks.

Any time I've ended up with a staggered clutch with any species I always end up losing the youngest chicks as when the older ones wean the parents stop feeding the rest of them or at least not as reliably as they did before.

I also prefer to use Societies to foster. I'm not sure how you are set up for breeding but if there is room in the Gouldians' cages/flights you could actually keep a pair in there with them. In my larger flights I do this. The rest of mine are paired in cages with Owl pairs or on their own in smaller breeding cages. Societies in my experience are easy to prep for fostering and once you have used them once you know whether they'll manage well or not. I have one pair that tries to wean the Gouldians (and Shaft-tails) to early, but they are fine fostering Owls and the other species that wean faster.

Another benefit to using Society fosters rather than sticking the eggs under another Gouldian pair is that I still know what chicks were produced by what pair. If a clutch of Gouldians from two different parents hatch out together I'll have to assume they are from the same parents and therefore related.

All that said, good luck with this clutch/pair.

[lovezebs]

Good luck.
I hope things work out for you, with at least a few of them.

~Elana~