Red Factor canaries

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CandoAviary
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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by CandoAviary » Tue May 24, 2011 3:49 pm

This breeder told me he thought it was a male... but had not heard it sing... I bought 20 from him and he warned me he was not 100% sure of that one and was upfront with it.
This breeder is very experienced, he bred and showed in Germany and definately knows what he is doing. I respect him too much to ask for a refund, especially after I bought him with his statement that he wasn't sure of that ones sex... he got the other 19 spot on :D
I did let him know what happened and he said that explained why the bird didn't sing :lol: He also thought the bird had some hormonal problems..
I plan on buying more birds in the future from him so I am sure he will treat me right. That is how we do it here anyways. Once I have a good relationship with a fellow breeder it is easy to work out problems.
The bird appeared the picture of health.... I guess with all the other canaries trying to roost it stimulated this one to ovalate...
A soft shelled eggbound bird can perish quickly. Otherwise this bird was very healthy. I'm just sorry I didn't discover her sooner. Possibly I could of save her.

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by CandoAviary » Wed May 25, 2011 1:17 am

ac12 wrote:Candace
I may want to buy some of the red suppliment for my wifes canary. She really wants him to get back to the orange that I brought him home as. Let me know when you have them in stock.
Gary, I know the shipping from here would be reasonable ladygouldianfinch.com ... It is also on sale :D You need to fed/water before the molt. The feathers form well before the old feather fall out and need the suppliment shile the feathers are forming :wink:
http://www.ladygouldianfinch.com/shoppi ... -color.mgi

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by ac12 » Wed May 25, 2011 6:05 pm

Candace
Which one do you recommend (Bogena or Canthaxantine), or should I get both?

The dosage mixing instructions seem difficult for only one bird.

Dumb question time:

My other problem is WHEN will the bird molt? If I wait till I see feathers in the cage, that is probably too late, as you mentioned the new feathers probably formed. If I need to get the suppliments fed before the molt begins, to color the forming feathers, how do I know when to begin adding more suppliements?

He had a light molt in Feb, which surprised me since the breeder said the canary will molt in the summer.
Gary

gouldians (GB,YB,BB), blackbelly firefinches (trying to breed), societies (foster parents).
red factor canary

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by Mynard » Wed May 25, 2011 6:35 pm

so beautiful-i love the colors =D>
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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by CandoAviary » Thu May 26, 2011 10:24 am

Thank You :D

Gary,
The second suppliment listed has both bogena and canthaxantine.
The first is great at coloring wing/tail feather the second, body feathers... so if you want to the most red this would be the chouice.
You will hear people say it is not safe to give year round, but this has been proven not to be so.
Breeders who show canaries use it year round because if the bird accidently looses a feather like from plucking then if they were not colorfed the replacement feather would come in not fully colored and could ruin their show winning chances. The problem comes in people overdosing the coloring suppliments. I guess they think the more suppliment the more red. This is not the case as the birds body will asorb only so much ...just like with vitamin A... if too much is given then toxic levels can be built up in the liver.
You can divide the dosage and mix small amounts. a few days supply of colored water can be kept in the refrigerator. Remember that canaries will drink bath water also so this may cause them to drink less of the colored water.
My routine when I bred these was to remove all water tubes at nightfall. In the morning when the birds were thirsty (most birds drink the majority of their water consumption for the day at daybreak/or in indoor set ups at lights on.)
This way I knew they got a good dosage of the suppliments. This is wise to do when administering meds like S76 also to ensure good intake of meds. I would later place the baths on for a a half hour or so. I always removed the baths within this time frame.
As far as knowing when the bird will molt...most will molt in the summer if kept at natural lighting... they will breed in the spring. However many breeder breed in timer controled rooms and can bring the birds into breeding condition almost anytim of the year. Thus affecting the molting time also. Most birds will molt following breeding season. When I bred I did so in the winter as this is when I had more free time from my grooming/boarding business. I was just too busy in the spring :| But once the birds are kept at the same seasonal rotaion, be it natural or artificially induce, the birds will molt at the same time each year. If the birds internal clocks are changed such may have happened with your bird movent to it's new home, also other stresses can cause a premature molt and these sometimes are not full molts. I am sure now that your canary has adjusted to his surrounding he will molt on a regular schedule... 6 weeks prior to molting is usually plent of time to start colorfeeding.
It is important to have an idea of when any bird will molt because it takes so much energy/protein to build new feathers that major complications can result if you are trying to breed the bird at the same time the bird is trying to build new feathers before the molt. This may result in poor feather quality of new feather, extreme difficult molts sometimes even killing the bird, neglect of the chicks being fed, etc. Once you see the feathers falling an the bird looking bedraggled it is a little late to correct the problem, much less colorfeed. I believe many keepers do not realize the importance of having a pre molting bird on a protein diet without the stress of breeding, rearing chicks........ Many even die unnecessary :(
If you start to colrfed say 3 weeks before the molt, some feather will have the red...some won't which can created a very interesting bird. A color that was popular in my aviary I termed the sunset canary... the head feathers are the last feather to be replace in a full molt. I would purposely colorfeed late so there was a gradual build of red coloration towards the head... resembly a sunet :D
This is not an actual color but a creation that I happened on as the result of one of my experiements and just happen to like. Some other did also and I always had a waiting list for those special fed birds :D One very important word of advice... No method of color feeding will generate red birds if the hue is not latent in the pedigree.
You must start with well bred birds :D
If you find the liquid mixing too much of a pain you can try the color nestling/egg foods..... mixed with egg or sprouts the birds will consume more. I use ABBA products now but have used most all brands at one time or another..... The ones I linked are convienant for everyone and afforadable.
http://www.petco.com/product/14864/Quik ... aries.aspx
This is one that you can mix with the pellets you are feeding...how simple is that :wink: especially bird that have a blue natural color... such as in the bronze canaries.
http://www.asongintheair.com/colorfooddescription.html

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by ac12 » Thu May 26, 2011 11:46 am

Candace
Thanks for the great info.

Creamcicle is an only canary.
No mate for him.
My wife does not want to breed him.

He has a light with a timer set for 7am to 8pm.
The only lighting change was adjusting to DST. I did it 30 min at a time over a week, so as to not make the 1 hr change suddenly.

I think what you said might have been our problem before. We did not get him his red veggies early enough. In our ignorance, we waited till we saw feathers on the cage floor, which as you said is too late.

He is now eating the Orlux red egg food. He ignored it for a long time.

He does eat veggies every day, so I think if we give him veggie high in betta carotein, rather than the plain greens, that will help.

I will order some of the red suppliement also, since I know he won't get enough from the veggies.

thanks again
Gary

gouldians (GB,YB,BB), blackbelly firefinches (trying to breed), societies (foster parents).
red factor canary

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by jonvill » Thu May 26, 2011 12:35 pm

I have red canaries too. I bought cantaxanthin from Silver Song West in the one ounce packets for less than $15 and it lasted for more than a year. I feed it in the corn bread and they eat every last bit. That minimizes waste and since it's not in the water there is less mess too. Here is a picture of my red black male:
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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by CandoAviary » Thu May 26, 2011 12:56 pm

Cornbread is an excellent way to use the coloring :D
Love your bird, some of the dark red are some of my most favorites :D

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by ac12 » Thu May 26, 2011 7:12 pm

@jonvile
Nice to meet another SF Bay Area fincher.
I do not recall seeing a small 1oz packet like that, but I did not look hard. Nice to know how long it will last also. Makes it less expensive if it lasts.
Gary

gouldians (GB,YB,BB), blackbelly firefinches (trying to breed), societies (foster parents).
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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by jonvill » Thu May 26, 2011 7:22 pm

Silver Song West sells one ounce packets for $10.45
I make a pan of corn bread with one spoonful of the included measuring spoon and I add 2 grated carrots and 1 tablespoon paprika
cut it into small squares wrap with foil and freeze until needed.
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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by ac12 » Thu May 26, 2011 10:34 pm

I will look for that at the next San Jose birdmart in June.
Gary

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by CandoAviary » Thu May 26, 2011 10:44 pm

Gary,
If you have a hard time getting your hands on some I will mail you a small amount once I get supplies unpacked. I have some that I ordered with one large shipment since I had bought these canaries...it is packed somewhere :? I have been feeding Ralf Red but I probably need to unpack some and get it into some birds before they start molting and loose their color :?

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by ac12 » Fri May 27, 2011 12:48 am

Thank you Candace,

I think I will have to order it.

In reading the description for Canthaxanthin and Bogena better,

• Canthaxanthin is very effective at coloring the contour feathers
• Bogena is good on the longer feathers on the wing and tail.

And being awake when I read it this time, I will need Bogena. It is the wing and tail feathers that have turned white, the body feathers are orange.

One of my guesses is that the wing/tail feathers were the first feathers to molt and by the time I saw it, it was too late to color feed for those feathers. But the body feathers if those molt later were able to be color fed. So it may also be my inability to color feed at the appropriate time.

I did find Silver Song West and they have 1 oz packets of Canthaxanthin, but no Bogena, so I will order that from ladygouldianfinch.

Thanks
Gary

gouldians (GB,YB,BB), blackbelly firefinches (trying to breed), societies (foster parents).
red factor canary

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by CandoAviary » Fri May 27, 2011 9:07 am

Happy Red Birding :D

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Re: Red Factor canaries

Post by ac12 » Sun Jun 05, 2011 12:52 am

Candace
I got the Bogena, and my wife is excited that her canary will go back to all orange after his next molt.

Can I mix a batch up enough for several days of drinking water changes? Or do I have to mix fresh every day?
And do I have to give it every day?

Thanks
Gary

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