Lavender waxbills

[Jen]

lovezebs
I definitely think you should consider them. They are so beautiful !!! Mine are in my outdoor aviary and pretty much stay away and hidden a lot of the time. So not sure how they would be in a smaller cage environment. I would think they are somewhat skittish....but they sure are pretty!!! As w.l. mentioned, spend some time observing them.

You really have a great pet shop that carries so many types of finches. Wish we had a place here like that. The pet shops here only have zebras, diamond doves, societies and budgies, never anything different or unique. I have to try and find different species at annual bird marts. Good luck!!!!

[Jen]

lovezebs
Oh my gosh!!! When I clicked on that link you shared about live food and those bugs popped up on the screen I almost dropped my coffee cup!!!!!!

[lovezebs]

Jen

Hi Jenny,

Did the little bugs make you drool just a little bit, evil little snicker.... ???

As to the two Lavenders....
They have been there for a bit, but of course no way of knowing if they are a true pair or not, not that it makes a huge difference, seeing as I haven't been really doing any breeding... One appears to be just a tad darker than the other, and one is a tiny bit plucked around the neck.

They are such an elegant bird, when one really takes a good look at them, which I think most people don't. Most gravitate towards the more colourful, more flashy birds.

[Sally]

Has anyone ordered anthing from these people?

https://frogs.org.au/live-foods/product ... y/insects/

I think they are in Australia.

[DamonIRB]

.... Some will say they can sex Orange-cheeked waxbills by looking at the vent area, with the males having more orange color than hens. The reality is that this is still just a guess IMO. After all, someone has a 50-50 chance of being right! Some hens will have more orange, while some males will have less.

I'm only speaking from my experience with my Black Rumped Red Ear waxbills (very similar to St Helena, but with a solid black tail). They say the male has a redder vent than the females, much like the coloring Sally mentioned with the Orange Cheeks. I'm a science dork. I like to know "why" things work the way they do. So I did some research to see if there is any merit to "males have a redder butt".

We all know some species are affected by carotenoids in their food. Red Factor Canaries are probably the best example - you need to feed them a diet high in carotenoids to keep their red bright and vibrant. Carotenoids is a fancy way of saying 'beta carotene' - it is the naturally occurring pigment in things like carrots, sweet potatoes, Swiss chard, etc. Most birds are not affected by carotenoids and there really isn't a good explanation as to why. But I have noticed ALL of my Red Ears are brighter, all over, when I put carrot in their diet on a daily basis.

My point... a redder/oranger/brighter/darker vent may be the result of a diet high in beta carotene and nothing more. It is a horrible way to determine sex.

Merely my opinion... ;)

D

[isobea]

DamonIRB - thanks for the great explanation. The same is true for some birds and the amount of sunlight they get (e.g. strawberries and European goldfinches - their red masks are affected).
Now is there a similar explanation for the amount of black around the vents of the lavenders? Or could that really be sex related? Or just plain vary from bird to bird?

Sally - yes, that 'insect website' is an Australian one.
The crickets made me think: Would tiny crickets be accepted by our waxbills? The company I get my mealworms from also breeds crickets. Walking into the front of their facility I always see tubs of crickets of various sizes.
Iso

[DamonIRB]

DamonIRB - thanks for the great explanation. The same is true for some birds and the amount of sunlight they get (e.g. strawberries and European goldfinches - their red masks are affected).
Now is there a similar explanation for the amount of black around the vents of the lavenders? Or could that really be sex related? Or just plain vary from bird to bird?

Ok... I'm going to go full-blown DORK on this one, so apologizes in advance!

All dark color in bird feathers, including black, comes from melanin. It's the same stuff that gives you and I our hair color, eye color, skin tone, etc. More melanin = darker colors. Does that equate to a darker vent in male Lavender Waxbills? Obviously, that would only be the case if melanin is more prominent in males, right? Beyond basic diet/nutrition, one of the key factors to melanin production is estrogen levels. More estrogen MAY trigger the production of more melanin, but that is iffy. For example, the cliche of "she has that pregnant glow" is fitting for some women because the pregnancy has increased estrogen production, which for that woman's physiology has triggered additional melanin production. Their skin physically changes in color because of the extra melanin. It doesn't always happen though.

So what does that have to do with your finches? Oddly enough, it is believed that a male birds ability to sing comes from high estrogen levels early in life. Both male and female birds produce estrogen, but some males do have more, which could lead to more melanin. But still... does that always equate to more or darker feathers in a specific area of the body, making it easier to sex them? Eh. I don't think so. Just like there are some species where the females sing as well, so there are always exceptions, even within a particular species.

A couple of links, just in case you have insomnia:

How birds make colorful feathers

Why do male birds sing?

[lovezebs]

Sally

Oh shoot, I think you're right. I didn't notice the .au

Ah well, I shall continue on my bug hunt

[lovezebs]

isobea

I have tried crickets a long time ago, and they sort of got out of the flights....but that's another story altogether...

My point is, that my birds didn't really care for them. In fact, they seemed a bit freaked out by them.

I think you'd have to bonk them on the head before putting them in (that's the crickets,, not the birds ).

[isobea]

DamonIRB - Thanks for the links. No insomnia but good reading during a much needed break from weeding in the backyard. So if the carotenoid is responsible for the bright yellow feathers of goldfinches, I wonder which plant/plants are lacking in the fall when they molt into their drab winter colors. And vice versa which ones are available very early in the spring before/while the yellow feathers are being grown.
As for the lavenders, it seems that I can try to use the amount of black feathers to figure out which ones might be males (aside from their song), but otherwise I might be just as successful using a pendulum (or guessing. I'd have a 50% of getting it right).
Iso

[isobea]

lovezebs - Elana, before I ever tried the tiniest crickets I would have to pay attention how they keep them inside those big plastic tubs at the breeding facility. Those tubs don't even have lids or screens but for the life of me I can't remember what it is that they put around the rim of the tubs. Something very ordinary, I've seen it several times but early Alzheimer's is taking its toll.
Once I know I can duplicate it in a small container inside the aviary (IF somebody on this forum tells me it might be worth the try).
And I vaguely do remember your - for us who were reading it - funny cricket experience in your kitchen...
Iso

[w.l.]

isobea

Since otherwise your chances would be 50-50, you might as well select by color and increase them a bit. Or let the trader choose for you based on that.
If you don't end up with a breeding pair, Lavenders should still be fun and beautiful to look at. Mine were never shy, to the contrary, ever active and curious.

I think mini crickets should be fine as livefood, maybe similar to fruit flies.

[isobea]

w.l. - I think I'll run up to the dealer as soon as the nights are not as cold anymore (3 C yesterday, last night and again tonight) before he sells out. I still think $75 a pair is a steal (especially compared to Elana's $180 a pair). And I plan on letting him select a pair for me but also ask him to show me the differences he is going by. For later next week they are predicting our lows as 12 C (54 F). That should work. Wish me luck.
Iso

[w.l.]

Of course if they are so cheap, you could further increase your chances by buying 4 or even just 3 birds, though once a pair is formed, you should separate them from the rest. If I were you, I'd buy 2 "pairs". It's also good to have back-up birds in case one dies or escapes.
Ask him when the birds were imported - captive conditions seem to influence color, so the fresher the birds, the more reliable the sexing by color should be.

[isobea]

w.l. - Thanks for your advice. I have one question, though: you said to buy four birds but then, once a pair is formed, to separate them. I couldn't just leave them all in the same aviary? I don't have a second one to move the other two into.
I will ask him when they were imported but usually I prefer to buy birds that have been at the seller's for several months hoping they won't be as fragile as new imports. E.g. I bought my male blue cap from a guy who had had him for six months and that bird is healthy as a horse even with our chilly nights calling and singing all day long.
Iso