cordon bleu blues

[gunard62]

hello everyone. i'm writing regarding the seemingly never ending battle of breeding cordon bleu finches. my pair have had 3 clutches and have thrown every chick out of the nest, at different stages of development. i provide egg food, live food, fresh veggies and fruit. so this is the low down: they are in a large indoor aviary 8ft long x 2ft wide x 31/2ft tall. they share the aviary with gouldians and owl finches. there were a mating pair of each but the males of both were found dead. i don't usually lose birds and all other birds are healthy. has anyone experienced cordon males killing other species when nesting?...also i was wondering if it is possible to separate the male from the female after the eggs hatch. i'm thinking the male is doing the tossing in order to breed and start a new nest. the other option is obviously separating the pair from all other finches...though this is difficult due to space. thanks and i look forward to hearing your comments and suggestions.

[Jen]

gunard62
I have breeding Red Cheek Cordon Blue's and have had a couple of successful fledges. My birds are in an outdoor aviary which is where they were successful. I didn't have such luck when I had them in my indoor flight. I found my birds to be extremely private and need to be left completely along...no nest checks, no banding, and I even avoid eye contact with walking past their nest (which I avoid walking in that area also). I offer several areas where I hang lots of artificial vines and bushes for them to hide their nest.

I also feed them live mini mealworms along with live termites that I am lucky enough to find on my property where trees have fallen and rotting. Waxbills are so beautiful but are definitely not the easiest to breed.

Best of luck with yours and keep us posted. They are soooo worth the trouble!!!!!!!

[gunard62]

thanks jenny. due to living in northern indiana an out flight isn't an option. i'm thinking about rearranging the room and giving them their own aviary with lots of greenery, maybe in the corner away from my usual path. do you know anywhere i can find termites...online to order. have'nt had much luck. thanks for the words of encouragement. don

[Sally]

gunard62 I don't know of any place in the U.S. that sells termites. If you do find any outside, you would have to be extremely cautious with them, as you don't want termites to get into your walls, that could be disastrous.

A member of NFSS has been successful breeding some very difficult species (Purple Grenadiers, for one). In addition to mini mealworms, she feeds Phoenix worms, which are black soldier fly larvae (maggots). In Europe, there are ready supplies of frozen maggots (they call them pinkies), but we aren't so lucky here.

I am trying out various live food sources. I recently ordered some black soldier fly larvae from a vendor in California, but the ones I received are larger than the trademarked Phoenix worms, and my birds like the smaller sizes.

I would be surprised if the CB was the culprit in the deaths of the Gouldian and Owl males, but then you have to wonder. I have a pair of Red-cheeked CBs in a flight cage that is roughly 37x27x48 tall, which they share with a pair of Red-billed Fire finches and a pair of Black-crowned waxbills. The BC waxbills are very timid and stay out of the way of everyone. The RB Fires will sort of defend their nest but it doesn't get any more serious than a little chasing. The RCCBs also sort of defend their nest, but I've never seen them get really aggressive with anyone. The most squabbling I see in this flight cage is between the Fire male and female and the RCCB male and female, not with other species. If I put another pair of CBs in this cage, I think it would be pandemonium.

Cordon Bleus are very difficult to breed in cages and indoors. As Jen has found, they do much better in an outside aviary, but in your area, that would be difficult. The only way that would work would be to try to breed them outside in the summer.

[Jen]

gunard62
Your thought about moving the flight out of everyday path and added greenery will definitely make a difference. As Sally said, you do not want to introduce termites anywhere inside your home. I offer mini mealworms which the LOVE.

I read somewhere online that you can bury cardboard underground (outdoors) and there were added instructions to making that attract termites into an area where you could capture them. I'm thinking of trying that since I have plenty of space away from my home....if I can find that online site again.

The only aggression I have seen with my CB's is between the males. When their first clutch matured and the males started nesting, there was some chasing and squawking at each other. But I have enough room that the males can fly away from each other and find a "hiding spot" until things cool down. In a flight cage I think you would have to separate the males (or pairs) when breeding started. The is true with Owls also. When in breeding mode, my males definitely chase after each other and keep the other male out of their home "territory".

You are on the right track to making it work. Don't give up! Keep us posted and best of luck with your guys!

[tt101]

Sally

Ohhhhhhh that is what pinkies are? I worked at a pet store for a couple months, we called baby mice pinkies, so when I read a few posts about people feeding their finches pinkies, I thought they were feeding baby mice

[Sally]

Sally

Ohhhhhhh that is what pinkies are? I worked at a pet store for a couple months, we called baby mice pinkies, so when I read a few posts about people feeding their finches pinkies, I thought they were feeding baby mice

Yes, I have heard that in North America, we call baby mice pinkies, while in Europe that term is for frozen maggots. Easy to see how confusing language can be!

[gunard62]

do you think it is possible to take the male from the cage and lewt the female raise the chicks?

[Sally]

You can try it if you wish, but normally any disturbance to the nest or the mating pair will cause abandonment. Of course, they are tossing anyway, so you don't have much to lose by trying it. Sometimes tossing is caused by a male wanting to start another clutch. With waxbills, it is simply very difficult in a cage to provide the environment they want--a planted aviary, plenty of privacy, plenty of live food.

[FLDoc]

Pip,

Where have you been finding finches? NW Indiana here too.

[Rox]

gunard62 At least your pairs hatch chicks. My one pair of blue-caps hasn't even attempted brooding yet, while the second pair keeps leading me on a merry chase. They act like they are brooding, go through the motions and then abandon nest. I think they do it on purpose just to get more mealworms... I did manage to get one blue-breasted cordon chick on the perch last year but waiting to see if that will happen again this season.

I also wouldn't recommend removing the male once the chicks hatch. It would probably be too much of a disturbance for the hen and then she will abandon. Perhaps increase the amount of live food you give and also offer it frequently throughout the day if you can. If they feel short of food at any stage, this also prompts them to toss.

I would also be very surprised if your cordon's caused the death of your other birds. Mine are all very gentle and mind their own business. I have never seen them get aggressive with other species.

[slwatson]

gunard62

I have a pair of BCCB's that I'm trying to breed in an indoor flight cage. They've just been taking me on a wild goose chase....One day they'll be in the nest, then next day not. I've never seen any eggs or live chicks on the floor of the cage, but I'm pretty sure they had at least one egg in the nest at one time. Last night I saw them mate again...sigh....this has been an ongoing cycle for a couple of months now. There was at least one day last week when they were both in the nest and never came out, but then they were out when I got home from work and never went back in

[slwatson]

I've been giving mine tons of live meal worms, but I just read on a website that if you provide too much live food or protein the overstimulated cock will toss the eggs or chicks to start breeding again.

It also said the hen can get "batter-hen syndrome" and lay too many eggs that have low fertility, and won't hatch, even if they're fostered. I know mine don't have that problem, but the one above could be possible.

How do you know when you're giving too much?

[gunard62]

ok guys....you are not going to believe this...check out my first post re cordon bleus and my suspicion that my male was killing other birds as well as his offspring. this morning i witnessed him attack his own mate. not aggressive breeding behavior but very vicious. she was on her back fighting for her life. i separated them and i was worried she wld not recover, she turned over and was laying flat on the cage floor with her wings spread out. crazy yes? he just must be one of those , once in a while , crazy aggressive finches. have you ever heard of such a thing?

[Sally]

I've never heard of a CB male being that aggressive with his mate, but that doesn't mean it hasn't happened before. When my RCCB pair were incubating eggs (which turned out to be infertile), the hen would aggressively chase male if he didn't promptly go in the nest when she came out for a break, but it was not serious.

However, once I removed the eggs, yesterday I heard fighting from that cage, and it was that pair, fighting on the floor of the cage. Quite serious, yet when I broke it up, there was no more fighting. I have no idea who was the aggressor, but it was the first time I've ever seen this very-bonded pair have a serious quarrel.