Bird Intellegence
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- Pip
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- delray
- Tech Assistant, Social Media Manager & Mod Extraordinaire
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Re: Bird Intellegence
Very interesting. I don't know! But i have a feeling that scientists haven't figured that out yet. Some of their actions they finches do does give a convincing case though.






Brian
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- Arama
- Perfect Partner
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- Location: Alberta, Canada
Re: Bird Intellegence
I'm going to go with yes and explain my reasoning. So situtation: my bird is staring at the weird beaded toy with dangly threads. Yes his instinct is saying that is a pretty awesome thing for nesting material but ultimately it's his choice to go and tug on it fruitlessly for 10minutes before he decides to give up and go preen himself in the corner and hope his girlfriend didn't witness his failure.
Trisha
Trisha
Trisha
- MiaCarter
- Molting
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Re: Bird Intellegence
Yes! Absolutely.
In most finches, it's quite difficult to determine what is instinctually driven and what behaviors are the result of independent thought.
But you can see many cases of independent thought in birds who are removed from their flock and spend most/all of their time interacting with humans. That forces the birds to develop their thinking mind, as they're in a situation where instinct doesn't always cut it.
Another member, Sandra has a little gouldian finch whom she hand raised and she is constantly exhibiting independent thought. I'll tag Sandra and perhaps she can chime in with a few examples.
One thing that comes to mind is the way Kiki plays. She engages Sandra by intentionally tossing a little bell on the floor so Sandra will pick it up.
I was a philosophy major as an undergrad in college and I did my senior thesis on philosophy of mind. I examined thought in non-human animals. Birds were one area where I performed a lot of study.
I came up with a theory of two minds (which applies to all creatures, humans included.)
Your instinctual mind is ruled by instincts and it's not really associated with conscious thought. The instinctual mind is more automatic and reflexive. It's focused on survival and fulfilling your basic needs.
This mind dominates in most non-human animals. They only seem to develop the thinking mind when there's something within the environment that necessitates this.
An example of the instinctual mind in humans is ducking when someone throws something at you or running when chased. You just act without consciously thinking.
You can override that instinctual mind, but it takes practice and effort (which is why it's so hard to eradicate certain behaviors in pets, like a dog who chases cats.)
The thinking mind is more conscious and it can overrule the instinctual mind. It seems to be an environmental thing. Birds who interact more with humans or other birds of different species tend to develop this thinking mind more than others would.
The thinking mind is at work when you have a bird who's teaching himself to open the cage door so he can get at his favorite toy.
Or, in the case of my budgies, opening cage doors to get at a bird that's annoying. My Pintail whydah starts singing at 5AM, before the lights even come on and it gets Louise very annoyed. So Louise opened the sliding door to get out of her cage, opened another sliding door to get into the PT Whydah's cage and proceeded to peck at him until I came running in shrieking like a banshee to break it up. (I now have to zip-tie the doors closed).
There are some birds in a national park that learned that backbacks and snowmobile packs often have food, so they've learned how to unzip zippers to steal the food.
But yes, there are lots of cases where you can see the thinking mind at work in finches and other birds. Some demonstrate incredible problem solving abilities too, which I think most agree doesn't fall within the realm of instinctual thought.
In most finches, it's quite difficult to determine what is instinctually driven and what behaviors are the result of independent thought.
But you can see many cases of independent thought in birds who are removed from their flock and spend most/all of their time interacting with humans. That forces the birds to develop their thinking mind, as they're in a situation where instinct doesn't always cut it.
Another member, Sandra has a little gouldian finch whom she hand raised and she is constantly exhibiting independent thought. I'll tag Sandra and perhaps she can chime in with a few examples.
One thing that comes to mind is the way Kiki plays. She engages Sandra by intentionally tossing a little bell on the floor so Sandra will pick it up.
I was a philosophy major as an undergrad in college and I did my senior thesis on philosophy of mind. I examined thought in non-human animals. Birds were one area where I performed a lot of study.
I came up with a theory of two minds (which applies to all creatures, humans included.)
Your instinctual mind is ruled by instincts and it's not really associated with conscious thought. The instinctual mind is more automatic and reflexive. It's focused on survival and fulfilling your basic needs.
This mind dominates in most non-human animals. They only seem to develop the thinking mind when there's something within the environment that necessitates this.
An example of the instinctual mind in humans is ducking when someone throws something at you or running when chased. You just act without consciously thinking.
You can override that instinctual mind, but it takes practice and effort (which is why it's so hard to eradicate certain behaviors in pets, like a dog who chases cats.)
The thinking mind is more conscious and it can overrule the instinctual mind. It seems to be an environmental thing. Birds who interact more with humans or other birds of different species tend to develop this thinking mind more than others would.
The thinking mind is at work when you have a bird who's teaching himself to open the cage door so he can get at his favorite toy.
Or, in the case of my budgies, opening cage doors to get at a bird that's annoying. My Pintail whydah starts singing at 5AM, before the lights even come on and it gets Louise very annoyed. So Louise opened the sliding door to get out of her cage, opened another sliding door to get into the PT Whydah's cage and proceeded to peck at him until I came running in shrieking like a banshee to break it up. (I now have to zip-tie the doors closed).
There are some birds in a national park that learned that backbacks and snowmobile packs often have food, so they've learned how to unzip zippers to steal the food.
But yes, there are lots of cases where you can see the thinking mind at work in finches and other birds. Some demonstrate incredible problem solving abilities too, which I think most agree doesn't fall within the realm of instinctual thought.
Humum to....
13 Zebra Finches....and 2 squeeps!
3 Society Finches
6 Gouldians
1 Weaver
1 Pintail Whydah
2 Cockatiels
2 Parakeets
....along with 1 MinPin, 1 Pug, 1 JRT, 1 Yorkie, 2 Chihuahuas and 15 cats.

www.PetFinchFacts.com
13 Zebra Finches....and 2 squeeps!
3 Society Finches
6 Gouldians
1 Weaver
1 Pintail Whydah
2 Cockatiels
2 Parakeets
....along with 1 MinPin, 1 Pug, 1 JRT, 1 Yorkie, 2 Chihuahuas and 15 cats.

www.PetFinchFacts.com
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- Wonder Wooer
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Re: Bird Intellegence
This is a great subject. I agree with Mia. I think all birds are capable of independent thought at their own level. Because finches are usually NOT raised like parrots, it is more difficult to 'measure' their independent thoughts.
My Kiki (hand raised gouldian finch) Seem to have her own mind. She very much reminds me of a parrot. She loves tossing toys on the floor. I don't know if its the sound or the falling that she loves but she will play as long as I am willing to pick toys back to her. Here's a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBFpqxEjXIE
When Kiki is out of her cage, she will see whoever she wants. I can be in the living room with Kiki on my shoulder and she will decide to go see my oldest son in his room. She has to think about this.
I believe the more interaction with a finch, the more it will get its mind to think.
My Kiki (hand raised gouldian finch) Seem to have her own mind. She very much reminds me of a parrot. She loves tossing toys on the floor. I don't know if its the sound or the falling that she loves but she will play as long as I am willing to pick toys back to her. Here's a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lBFpqxEjXIE
When Kiki is out of her cage, she will see whoever she wants. I can be in the living room with Kiki on my shoulder and she will decide to go see my oldest son in his room. She has to think about this.
I believe the more interaction with a finch, the more it will get its mind to think.
- MiaCarter
- Molting
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Re: Bird Intellegence
Sandra -- That's an especially good example of Kiki visiting your son in his room.
It shows she has a concept of object permanence.
Even human babies don't have this skill until a certain age, so it's a fairly advanced mental ability and one that proves independent thought.
Object permanence works like this.
If you DON'T have a sense of object permanence, then if I take a toy and cover it with a blanket, that toy is literally gone to you. In other words, if you don't see it, it doesn't exist. (That's why peek-a-boo is so alluring to young babies. It's one helluva trick when you think about it. You're literally flickering in and out of existence for the baby who doesn't grasp object permanence!)
If you DO have a sense of object permanence, then you'll understand that the toy still exists under the blanket, even if you can't see it.
So Kiki shows her understanding by going into Sandra's son's room to visit him. This shows that she understands that Sandra's son still exists, even if she can't see him. (If she didn't understand object permanence, then there would be no need to go into the room... as Sandra's son wouldn't exist to Kiki unless he was standing in front of her.)
Of course, I'm assuming that Kiki is going into the room to visit with the son (and not to see some object that she enjoys, for instance.)
Object permanence a concept that's easy to prove in most birds. Simply cover a favorite toy or treat with a lightweight fabric or paper towel. If they try to go under (or through) the paper towel to get to the toy/treat, then it shows they understand object permanence -- they understand that the object still exists, even though they can't see it.
An understanding of object permanence can be displayed in other ways too. For instance, one of my cockatiels was obsessed with chewing on a light cord, even after I sprayed it with bitter apple. So I took a paper towel roll, slit it along the length and put it over the cord. She proceeded to pull it off to get to the cord again. She understood that the cord still existed, even if it wasn't visible through the paper towel roll. (For the record, I had to put it inside a PVC tube to Abby-proof the cord.)
It shows she has a concept of object permanence.
Even human babies don't have this skill until a certain age, so it's a fairly advanced mental ability and one that proves independent thought.
Object permanence works like this.
If you DON'T have a sense of object permanence, then if I take a toy and cover it with a blanket, that toy is literally gone to you. In other words, if you don't see it, it doesn't exist. (That's why peek-a-boo is so alluring to young babies. It's one helluva trick when you think about it. You're literally flickering in and out of existence for the baby who doesn't grasp object permanence!)
If you DO have a sense of object permanence, then you'll understand that the toy still exists under the blanket, even if you can't see it.
So Kiki shows her understanding by going into Sandra's son's room to visit him. This shows that she understands that Sandra's son still exists, even if she can't see him. (If she didn't understand object permanence, then there would be no need to go into the room... as Sandra's son wouldn't exist to Kiki unless he was standing in front of her.)
Of course, I'm assuming that Kiki is going into the room to visit with the son (and not to see some object that she enjoys, for instance.)
Object permanence a concept that's easy to prove in most birds. Simply cover a favorite toy or treat with a lightweight fabric or paper towel. If they try to go under (or through) the paper towel to get to the toy/treat, then it shows they understand object permanence -- they understand that the object still exists, even though they can't see it.
An understanding of object permanence can be displayed in other ways too. For instance, one of my cockatiels was obsessed with chewing on a light cord, even after I sprayed it with bitter apple. So I took a paper towel roll, slit it along the length and put it over the cord. She proceeded to pull it off to get to the cord again. She understood that the cord still existed, even if it wasn't visible through the paper towel roll. (For the record, I had to put it inside a PVC tube to Abby-proof the cord.)
Humum to....
13 Zebra Finches....and 2 squeeps!
3 Society Finches
6 Gouldians
1 Weaver
1 Pintail Whydah
2 Cockatiels
2 Parakeets
....along with 1 MinPin, 1 Pug, 1 JRT, 1 Yorkie, 2 Chihuahuas and 15 cats.

www.PetFinchFacts.com
13 Zebra Finches....and 2 squeeps!
3 Society Finches
6 Gouldians
1 Weaver
1 Pintail Whydah
2 Cockatiels
2 Parakeets
....along with 1 MinPin, 1 Pug, 1 JRT, 1 Yorkie, 2 Chihuahuas and 15 cats.

www.PetFinchFacts.com
- lovezebs
- Mod Extraordinaire
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Re: Bird Intellegence
MiaCarter
Quite fascinating really.
I have to admit, I've never given it all that much thought, beyond the realization, that some birds appear to be more intelligent than others.
My Canaries and Gouldians, strike me as more intelligent than some others, for the fact that they have come to realize, that I'm not going to hurt them. Some others go through their lives in a state of panic, eventhough I have never hurt them.
My budgie Freebee, has learned to untwist twist ties, but shows no interest in opening a cage door. She likes puzzles and things that challange her brain. Her cage mate Opie, couldn't care less, as long as he has his basic essentials, he's content. This leads to believe, that even in a species, there are some individuals who are more clever than others.
~Elana~
Quite fascinating really.
I have to admit, I've never given it all that much thought, beyond the realization, that some birds appear to be more intelligent than others.
My Canaries and Gouldians, strike me as more intelligent than some others, for the fact that they have come to realize, that I'm not going to hurt them. Some others go through their lives in a state of panic, eventhough I have never hurt them.
My budgie Freebee, has learned to untwist twist ties, but shows no interest in opening a cage door. She likes puzzles and things that challange her brain. Her cage mate Opie, couldn't care less, as long as he has his basic essentials, he's content. This leads to believe, that even in a species, there are some individuals who are more clever than others.
~Elana~
~Elana~
Linnies~ Canaries ~ Zebras ~ Societies ~ Gouldians ~ Orange Cheeks ~ Shaft Tails ~ Strawberries ~ Red Cheek Cordon Bleu ~ Goldbreasts ~ Red Brows ~ Owls ~ Budgies ~ Diamond Firetails ~ Javas ~ Forbes Parrot Finches ~
Linnies~ Canaries ~ Zebras ~ Societies ~ Gouldians ~ Orange Cheeks ~ Shaft Tails ~ Strawberries ~ Red Cheek Cordon Bleu ~ Goldbreasts ~ Red Brows ~ Owls ~ Budgies ~ Diamond Firetails ~ Javas ~ Forbes Parrot Finches ~
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- Hatchling
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Re: Bird Intellegence
When I free flight my zebras they usually end up in the next room where they like to perch on top of the curtains. The cage would be out of sight for them, but when they are fed up with flying about they go back to the cage and fly back into the open doors.
Squeak was the first one to learn how to do this, he will approach the cage and then hover down to where he knows the doors are and then flies right in. Out of the 8 I have he strikes me as the most intelligent, the two fledges have yet to learn how to get back into the cage on their own.
Squeak was the first one to learn how to do this, he will approach the cage and then hover down to where he knows the doors are and then flies right in. Out of the 8 I have he strikes me as the most intelligent, the two fledges have yet to learn how to get back into the cage on their own.
- MiaCarter
- Molting
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Re: Bird Intellegence
I think it's important to mention that there are different types of intelligence.
Problem solving intelligence is one.
Social intelligence is another.
Just like people, some birds have one and not the other.
I've noticed that necessity seems to drive learning and intelligence. They only develop certain forms of intelligence if there's a need for it. (Which is why hand-raised birds seem smarter than parent-raised. When interacting with humans, instinctual-driven thoughts and behaviors don't always cut it. So they're forced to develop new strategies.)
For instance, my budgie never learned to open the cage because he's got all his toys and food inside the cage and that's all he needs at night. And during the day, he can fly free outside the cage.
It wasn't until Felix started with his 5AM singing solo that he had a reason to figure it out. So the annoyance drove him to figure out the cage doors.
I think that's true of all animals, including humans --- necessity drives them to develop beyond that instinctually-driven thought. This is a theory that's been proven time and time again with feral children (who rarely develop more than primitive behaviors.)
And since most finches don't socialize with humans or other species, they never really "need" to develop that higher intelligence with independent, conscious thought.
I think it also swings the other way too. Sometimes it seems like they should understand something, yet they don't.
For instance, Abby my cockatiel loves riding around on my head. If I'm in that bird room, she's on my head.
When we go into the adjoining bathroom to clean out the dishes, Abby gets all goofy and showy. She puffs her feathers and flaps her wings and puts on a big show for the cockatiel who lives in the bathroom mirror. (It's a clearly territorial type of behavior).
When she's walking around on the counter, she'll go right up to the mirror and seems to understand it's her reflection by the way she moves around and looks at herself. After she checks out her reflection for 30-60 sec, that's the end of it, as she's not big on mirrors.
Yet when she's on my head, she gets all silly and acts all territorial to that bird who lives in the mirror.
I have no idea why she understands the mirror when she's on the counter, but when she's on my head, it's a different story. Cockatiels are very smart, especially Abby who's a big problem solver. So it befuddles me that she doesn't "get it".
@lovezebs --- becoming tame and less fearful of humans is another GREAT example of independent thought.
It's their natural instinct to fear humans, so it takes intelligence to consciously override and work through that fear.
I've found that the birds who don't get tame tend to stay wild because they don't have sufficient motivation/incentive to override the instinctual fear.
The birds who become tame/semi-tame tend to fall into one of three categories:
-hand raised, so they overcame the instinctual fear at a young age and/or that instinctual fear never fully developed
-they find socializing with humans inherently rewarding. Those birds tend to become the most social and tame because the actual interaction is a reward.
-they're very food-motivated, and the food serves as sufficient reward for them to confront that instinctual fear. These birds tend to be more conditionally tame (e.g. they'll visit if you have food, but if you don't have food, then they back off.)
Again, I guess it all comes down to necessity.
Taming is all about forming a trust and realizing that you won't do anything unexpected or frightening. But it's hard to notice anything the human is doing when you're frantically fluttering around a cage. So I think the most skiddish and flighty birds have this working against them. So if you're going to form any sort of trust, you need to wait out the flightyness and let them calm. Then hang out for a bit so they can actually watch and observe you and get to know your mannerisms and so forth.
Problem solving intelligence is one.
Social intelligence is another.
Just like people, some birds have one and not the other.
I've noticed that necessity seems to drive learning and intelligence. They only develop certain forms of intelligence if there's a need for it. (Which is why hand-raised birds seem smarter than parent-raised. When interacting with humans, instinctual-driven thoughts and behaviors don't always cut it. So they're forced to develop new strategies.)
For instance, my budgie never learned to open the cage because he's got all his toys and food inside the cage and that's all he needs at night. And during the day, he can fly free outside the cage.
It wasn't until Felix started with his 5AM singing solo that he had a reason to figure it out. So the annoyance drove him to figure out the cage doors.
I think that's true of all animals, including humans --- necessity drives them to develop beyond that instinctually-driven thought. This is a theory that's been proven time and time again with feral children (who rarely develop more than primitive behaviors.)
And since most finches don't socialize with humans or other species, they never really "need" to develop that higher intelligence with independent, conscious thought.
I think it also swings the other way too. Sometimes it seems like they should understand something, yet they don't.
For instance, Abby my cockatiel loves riding around on my head. If I'm in that bird room, she's on my head.
When we go into the adjoining bathroom to clean out the dishes, Abby gets all goofy and showy. She puffs her feathers and flaps her wings and puts on a big show for the cockatiel who lives in the bathroom mirror. (It's a clearly territorial type of behavior).
When she's walking around on the counter, she'll go right up to the mirror and seems to understand it's her reflection by the way she moves around and looks at herself. After she checks out her reflection for 30-60 sec, that's the end of it, as she's not big on mirrors.
Yet when she's on my head, she gets all silly and acts all territorial to that bird who lives in the mirror.
I have no idea why she understands the mirror when she's on the counter, but when she's on my head, it's a different story. Cockatiels are very smart, especially Abby who's a big problem solver. So it befuddles me that she doesn't "get it".
@lovezebs --- becoming tame and less fearful of humans is another GREAT example of independent thought.
It's their natural instinct to fear humans, so it takes intelligence to consciously override and work through that fear.
I've found that the birds who don't get tame tend to stay wild because they don't have sufficient motivation/incentive to override the instinctual fear.
The birds who become tame/semi-tame tend to fall into one of three categories:
-hand raised, so they overcame the instinctual fear at a young age and/or that instinctual fear never fully developed
-they find socializing with humans inherently rewarding. Those birds tend to become the most social and tame because the actual interaction is a reward.
-they're very food-motivated, and the food serves as sufficient reward for them to confront that instinctual fear. These birds tend to be more conditionally tame (e.g. they'll visit if you have food, but if you don't have food, then they back off.)
Again, I guess it all comes down to necessity.
Taming is all about forming a trust and realizing that you won't do anything unexpected or frightening. But it's hard to notice anything the human is doing when you're frantically fluttering around a cage. So I think the most skiddish and flighty birds have this working against them. So if you're going to form any sort of trust, you need to wait out the flightyness and let them calm. Then hang out for a bit so they can actually watch and observe you and get to know your mannerisms and so forth.
Humum to....
13 Zebra Finches....and 2 squeeps!
3 Society Finches
6 Gouldians
1 Weaver
1 Pintail Whydah
2 Cockatiels
2 Parakeets
....along with 1 MinPin, 1 Pug, 1 JRT, 1 Yorkie, 2 Chihuahuas and 15 cats.

www.PetFinchFacts.com
13 Zebra Finches....and 2 squeeps!
3 Society Finches
6 Gouldians
1 Weaver
1 Pintail Whydah
2 Cockatiels
2 Parakeets
....along with 1 MinPin, 1 Pug, 1 JRT, 1 Yorkie, 2 Chihuahuas and 15 cats.

www.PetFinchFacts.com
- lnlovesorange
- 4 Eggs Laid
- Posts: 801
- Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2015 5:10 pm
- Location: Massachusetts
Re: Bird Intellegence
MiaCarter I literally feel smarter after reading this. You are smart as a whip huh? Not sure if this is the same thing, but someone told me once that my finches don't "know" that I can't hurt them or get at them through the cage. However, when the cage is shut(last night for instance, i bought hay and put it on the cage floor to encourage the fledges to "forage" they loved it btw) and i sat next to the cage with my face literally touching the bars at some points (i was fascinated, LOVE watching them) and they came right up to my face...like if i stuck out my tongue i would have licked them!!! BUT if that cage door wasn't shut they would NEVER get that close to me... It's like they KNOW I can't get at them through the cage.... that's some kind of thinking... maybe not what we are talking about here, but it's some intelligence. Also, since i got my birds, I've said to my male (Melvin) "sing me a pretty song, Melvin, where's my pretty song" and he looks at me and cocks his head, then sings... does it when my mom asks too...coincidence? maybe, but it's a pretty crazy coincidence...and he does it even if he wasn't singing prior to me asking... so I have seen a lot of things in my finches, that I'm like WOW (like the color of their treat dish... they wouldn't eat out of a dish one day and thought hmmmm.. so i brought it back on a blue dish which is what all their treats were on before, and they went right to it..) But so i deffinitely see some intelligence (not sure if it's the kind we are addressing in this thread, but I'm nosy and had to put in my two cents!!) But like Mia said, there's some things that i'm like really? come on you guys you're smarter than this!!! (like when i open the cage to put food in and they all freak out...) ugh...work in progress!!! Thanks for this thread though, I literally feel smarter, and what an interesting topic. MiaCarter, I'd be interested to read that thesis of yours, sounds like you may have come across a lot of interesting things!!!
[thumbnail]http://www.finchbreederdatabase.com/php ... hp?id=1276[/thumbnail]~LN~
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- Pip
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- Location: New Orleans, LA USA
Re: Bird Intellegence
This is such great feedback! My husband tends to feel that I am giving our birds personality traits because it makes having birds so much more fun. Our wild finch (Peep) was a rescue bird/fledgling and I literally pried his beak open to feed him baby bird formula. Now, a year later, he still lets me feed him. He is picky though. He will turn away if he doesn't want to eat a dried meal worm then turn back to gobble up a bit of celery. He only bathes in fresh water. He squawks when something is not right in his cage. When I added sticks and small branches to his cage he was horrified. I then realized he had never seem those things before and removed them.
He does love running and flying around with hay in his mouth. He seems to want to build a nest for the bird in the mirror in his cage. Can I help him figure out how to make a nest or is running around with the hay enough?
We have two society finches in a cage above his because he became aggressive one of them. He still tries to get at them and I shudder at the notion that he might learn to open and close doors....!
He does love running and flying around with hay in his mouth. He seems to want to build a nest for the bird in the mirror in his cage. Can I help him figure out how to make a nest or is running around with the hay enough?
We have two society finches in a cage above his because he became aggressive one of them. He still tries to get at them and I shudder at the notion that he might learn to open and close doors....!
buckie74
- MiaCarter
- Molting
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Re: Bird Intellegence
buckie74 -- That's interesting about your Peep! I remember Peep from prior conversations! Peep is a sparrow, if I recall?
I think we definitely attribute human qualities and personalities to non-human animals. We can't help it. We're human and so our view of the world is colored by that human-ness; we can't easily step outside of that humanity. I don't think there's anything wrong with humanizing non-human animals, as long as:
- the animal's needs are met;
- and you understand that you're humanizing them (and you understand that at the core, they are profoundly different from humans.)
This is important! Sometimes, people humanize a creature to the point where its needs aren't properly met. (e.g. the purse dog comes to mind as an example. The dog is turned into a little dress-up toy and toted around in a purse. It never has a chance to just be a dog -- to roll around in mud and run through the grass and wrestle around with another dog and rip up important papers. The purse dog exists but it doesn't thrive because it's humanized to a degree where its innate dog-ness is totally denied.)
I'm as guilty as they come when it comes to humanizing my birds (and dogs....and cats.) But while I frequently afford them human qualities, I do understand that they are birds/dogs/cats and as such, view themselves and the world in a very different way.
That's cute about the hay! I'd give him some hay and let him have at it for a nest! Give him a little canary nest and see what he does. He may try to build a nest or he may just enjoy playing with the hay. Or both. You can offer other nesting materials too.
For new cage items, I always place the item alongside the cage for a day or two so they can see it without having it inside their cage, which is sort of a safe-haven environment. They can venture near the new item during free fly or keep their distance if they prefer. But letting them see it before it's right in their face is a good thing!
lnlovesorange -- My thesis was such a fun piece to research and write. It's like 150 pages long and I explored all things related to the philosophy of the mind as it applies to non-human animals. (Are non-human animals conscious? Are they capable of intelligent thought? Do non-human animals experience emotions? Do they have a concept of self? How do they perceive the world?)
It's a bit "thick" and heavy, so reads like a philosophy piece, so not so good for good light reading. LOL
Though someday, I should distill all that research into something that's less academic and more palatable to the masses. I uncovered tons of interesting studies, findings and even conducted a few experiments myself.
But you should check out a book called The Hidden Life of Dogs by Elizabeth Marshall Thomas.
Yes, it's about dogs, but many of the concepts she discusses can be applied to other species too.
Basically, the author would let her dogs roam free throughout the streets of Cambridge, MA (which is a major city....I can't imagine letting your dogs loose in a city!) But she did and one day, she started following them and watching them and she uncovered and analyzed all sorts of interesting things about animal behavior.
It's a short book --- easy to read in an afternoon. Definitely recommend it to anyone who's contemplating animal intelligence.
I think we definitely attribute human qualities and personalities to non-human animals. We can't help it. We're human and so our view of the world is colored by that human-ness; we can't easily step outside of that humanity. I don't think there's anything wrong with humanizing non-human animals, as long as:
- the animal's needs are met;
- and you understand that you're humanizing them (and you understand that at the core, they are profoundly different from humans.)
This is important! Sometimes, people humanize a creature to the point where its needs aren't properly met. (e.g. the purse dog comes to mind as an example. The dog is turned into a little dress-up toy and toted around in a purse. It never has a chance to just be a dog -- to roll around in mud and run through the grass and wrestle around with another dog and rip up important papers. The purse dog exists but it doesn't thrive because it's humanized to a degree where its innate dog-ness is totally denied.)
I'm as guilty as they come when it comes to humanizing my birds (and dogs....and cats.) But while I frequently afford them human qualities, I do understand that they are birds/dogs/cats and as such, view themselves and the world in a very different way.
That's cute about the hay! I'd give him some hay and let him have at it for a nest! Give him a little canary nest and see what he does. He may try to build a nest or he may just enjoy playing with the hay. Or both. You can offer other nesting materials too.
For new cage items, I always place the item alongside the cage for a day or two so they can see it without having it inside their cage, which is sort of a safe-haven environment. They can venture near the new item during free fly or keep their distance if they prefer. But letting them see it before it's right in their face is a good thing!
lnlovesorange -- My thesis was such a fun piece to research and write. It's like 150 pages long and I explored all things related to the philosophy of the mind as it applies to non-human animals. (Are non-human animals conscious? Are they capable of intelligent thought? Do non-human animals experience emotions? Do they have a concept of self? How do they perceive the world?)
It's a bit "thick" and heavy, so reads like a philosophy piece, so not so good for good light reading. LOL
Though someday, I should distill all that research into something that's less academic and more palatable to the masses. I uncovered tons of interesting studies, findings and even conducted a few experiments myself.
But you should check out a book called The Hidden Life of Dogs by Elizabeth Marshall Thomas.
Yes, it's about dogs, but many of the concepts she discusses can be applied to other species too.
Basically, the author would let her dogs roam free throughout the streets of Cambridge, MA (which is a major city....I can't imagine letting your dogs loose in a city!) But she did and one day, she started following them and watching them and she uncovered and analyzed all sorts of interesting things about animal behavior.
It's a short book --- easy to read in an afternoon. Definitely recommend it to anyone who's contemplating animal intelligence.
Humum to....
13 Zebra Finches....and 2 squeeps!
3 Society Finches
6 Gouldians
1 Weaver
1 Pintail Whydah
2 Cockatiels
2 Parakeets
....along with 1 MinPin, 1 Pug, 1 JRT, 1 Yorkie, 2 Chihuahuas and 15 cats.

www.PetFinchFacts.com
13 Zebra Finches....and 2 squeeps!
3 Society Finches
6 Gouldians
1 Weaver
1 Pintail Whydah
2 Cockatiels
2 Parakeets
....along with 1 MinPin, 1 Pug, 1 JRT, 1 Yorkie, 2 Chihuahuas and 15 cats.

www.PetFinchFacts.com
- lnlovesorange
- 4 Eggs Laid
- Posts: 801
- Joined: Mon Jan 12, 2015 5:10 pm
- Location: Massachusetts
Re: Bird Intellegence
MiaCarter I know Cambridge, remember I'm a Lynn girl!! That's crazy I wouldn't let my dogs roam free in Cambridge either!!! Any thoughts on the other things I mentioned about the birds knowing the barrier of the cage? Also, I am going to PM you about something else. But i deffinitely recommend (you know in ALL your FREE time...
) you dumbing down that thesis, I'd be willing to bet it's very interesting stuff, and I am absolutely going to get that book, so thanks!!!

[thumbnail]http://www.finchbreederdatabase.com/php ... hp?id=1276[/thumbnail]~LN~
-
- Pip
- Posts: 21
- Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2015 9:10 pm
- Location: New Orleans, LA USA
Re: Bird Intellegence
We think Peep is a wild finch. We bought one society finch (Peck) for him as a friend. That bird was the only one the lady at the store could catch. All went well until Peep grew bigger and aggressive toward the society finch. Peck was cowering on the floor of the cage trying to hide and stopped singing. Once we separated them, we decided Peck needed a friend. This time I told the lady at the store that I wanted a specific bird, one that was getting in and out of one of those small basket-like hutches. This bird is lively and will go anywhere in the cage. Peck goes to his "safe place" above the hutch if the other birds get too lively. He sings again and gets along well with the new bird. I wondered about intelligence and personality type because Peck seems so retiring, Peep is so busy, and the new bird is so lively. Nothing like human personality
traits....!
I feed Peep in the cage occasionally. He likes cold celery the best!



I feed Peep in the cage occasionally. He likes cold celery the best!

buckie74
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- Wonder Wooer
- Posts: 316
- Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 10:04 am
- Location: Ottawa, Ontario
Re: Bird Intellegence
I'm not sure if this counts,
My first Gouldian pair I had, was Kiki's mom and a blue back diluted red head male. The male unfortunately died. It was so sad to see the hen go see her mate after he died. She was sad after he crossed over. So even if she couldn't see him, she remembered him for sure.
Mia, you are right. Kiki is the happiest with us (humans) She doesn't look to go anywhere. I'll be sweeping, washing the dishes and she's the happiest little thing on my shoulder. BUT if she see's someone eating or playing on the Ipad, she will have a preference for that person.
My first Gouldian pair I had, was Kiki's mom and a blue back diluted red head male. The male unfortunately died. It was so sad to see the hen go see her mate after he died. She was sad after he crossed over. So even if she couldn't see him, she remembered him for sure.
Mia, you are right. Kiki is the happiest with us (humans) She doesn't look to go anywhere. I'll be sweeping, washing the dishes and she's the happiest little thing on my shoulder. BUT if she see's someone eating or playing on the Ipad, she will have a preference for that person.