Sprouting seed

[diinin]

WOW. I can see why they call it pure liquid gold! That stuff is expensive!

I'm going to experiment. I'll do a few glasses of seed in different ways, like maybe at the draining point, I could rinse it too and add some more ACV. I'll try doing a 4-hr soak and maybe 8 hour sit after the drain on one. For another I will put it in the frig right after the drain, and see if it will sprout in there. Something has GOT to work. I just don't want to have to grow it in potting soil. That would be a real pain.

[nixity]

I have experimented with every possible water additive meant to prevent fungus/mold from developing:

Sparkle
ACV
GSE
and now Virkon-S

The ONLY thing I would use for soaking/sprouting is the Virkon-S because it's the ONLY one that is a true fungicide out of the above options.

Sparkle is really meant as a prohibitive in drinking water and is the same ingredient as the disinfectant mouth washes the Dentist sometimes give you after a cleaning.
It is good for short term bacterial inhibition so if you are leaving for a day and want something in the water to help stave off bugs. So while it might be suitable while the seeds are actually soaking in the solution, once drained I do not think the properties "stick" to the seed enough to continue to be of any benefit.

ACV is not a strong enough disinfectant when diluted to really work, especially after the solution has been drained off of the seeds. Undiluted it is too acidic and might kill the seeds.

It has been proven in lab tests that the quality of GSE that makes it a "disinfectant" is the preservative used in bottling it. So the "all natural" options that are free of this preservative have NO disinfectant properties and you're wasting your money. Even still, the amount of antimicrobial properties it offered was minimal in comparison to something like Virkon S.

After Misty sent me some of her own to try I was hooked. I will never use ANYTHING else to sprout.
Yes - it is expensive in its own right, but at least it actually works.

With the Sparkle/ACV/GSE after about two uses my jars would definitely this brown film on the glass that I presume was some type of brown algae.
A true fungicide would not allow such growth. With the Virkon-S, the glass stays crystal clear through multiple uses.

[nixity]

I just don't want to have to grow it in potting soil. That would be a real pain.

Growing it in soil would also defeat the purpose - you don't want a full blown sprout/shoot.. you want it where the chit, as its called, has just barely begin to split the seed hull and peek out.
This is when it's at its most nutritious, anything more than a 1/4" tail is a waste because the seed has spent all its energy, protein, nutrients, etc., in producing the shoot and at that point it's just fun to eat but not any better (nutritionally) than dry seed (actually, it's probably a little less nutritious than dry seed at that point).

If you have really good eyesight you can see this after about 24 hours with the BRU white sprout mix, otherwise you might need the help of a little hand held magnifying glass

[diinin]

I'm glad you explained why the chit stage is so important. I had been wondering about that.

I just read about Virkon-S, and it doesn't appear to be made for ingesting. How do you know it is safe, since the seed must absorb the solution it's soaking in, in order to sprout?

This seed chits so quickly, it wouldn't even require that something be effective for very long. I don't mind sprouting it each time, since it's only twice a week. So I wonder if Sparkle might be the way to go?

I started a couple jars last night, one with plain tap water, and the other in tap water with a couple drops of ACV in it. They soaked all night at room temp and then I drained them and put them in the frig. (I rinsed the plain water one first). So far, 24 hours later, no mold that I can see, and several of the white seeds have chitted (?) already even in the frig. But that also made it too late to give to the birdies, so I have to wait until tomorrow morning and hope they are still mold free.

I had been using filtered water, which removes the chlorine, so maybe that was part of the problem. I wouldn't mind using Virkon-S if I knew for sure it was safe, though.

[wellingtoncdm]

I soak the seed with GSE added to the water and never ever have mold or sour smelling seed. I totally trust it. When I have soaked without it the seed went bad. A 20.00 bottle will last for many months. I am willing to pay that price. Mike fidler's "At Home With" DVD has a great system for sprouting seed as well as using Virkon-S.

[nixity]

I just read about Virkon-S, and it doesn't appear to be made for ingesting. How do you know it is safe, since the seed must absorb the solution it's soaking in, in order to sprout?

This seed chits so quickly, it wouldn't even require that something be effective for very long. I don't mind sprouting it each time, since it's only twice a week. So I wonder if Sparkle might be the way to go?
.

Of course, you wouldn't feed the powder or tablet form of Virkon to your birds in the same way you wouldn't feed straight ACV or Sparkle, or even GSE to your birds.
Even GSE, if not diluted, can be caustic to a bird's crop.

The dry powder of Virkon is caustic to skin - but the diluted anti-septic solution is no longer dangerous.
I have used it for over a year without any problems.
Before STGF had automatic watering systems in place, they would use the cleaning strength of virkon to soak the waterers at the facility.
After the soaking time, they would take the watereres out and re-fill them with water without even rinsing them first.

If anyone is familiar with the Dr. Marshall products, the KD Water Cleanser, which is advised to use internally, contains the same ingredient (I think just a different strength/%) as Virkon.

[CandoAviary]

I like the product Vanodine. It is not only great at fighting fungi but it also has viral and bacterial combatting activities.
Plus it has iodine Only downside I have found is it can stain light surfaces when not diluted properly. Also sometime scarace in the country as it is a UK product.
Having noted this great product, I use it for cleaning and air purifying mostly. When I soak seed I use plain tap water . I rinse on a very regular cycle, sometimes hourly so the clean seed doesn't get the chance to 'sour'. I also don't leave it in the cage for long either. I realize that this doesn't work for a lot of peoples schedules so they need to resort to chemical means. I am just a naturalist at heart. You can also acheive the benifits of high protein seed by growing your own grasses. When the seed heads are in the green stage is when the seeds 'milk' has the highest protein. Can't get much better than mother nature. Granted, in nature, dried seed that falls from the ground and sprouts/chits after a rainstorm is devoured by finches. You would think that this old seed on the ground would be full of germs. However, most wild finches and outdoor aviary birds have a healthy immune system with intestines full of natural probiotic ensymes. The probiotic ensymes allows them to digest and protect from many harmful fungus, yeast, and bacterias without causing deadly diarrhea. I have had my birds eat sprouted seed from the bottom of the aviary floor that got wet from bath splashing from the water fountain and thy never got sick. But I do offer probiotics everday in their seed

[diinin]

For the moment, I'm trying the frequent rinse method. My schedule does allow this, if I'm doing sprouted seed only twice a week. I can just stick it in the frig if I can't rinse it for a period of time. If that doesn't work, I'll try the Virkon. I had no idea sprouting seed would be such a chore! Can't imagine that people with huge numbers of birds are able to do this.

[diinin]

Mike fidler's "At Home With" DVD has a great system for sprouting seed as well as using Virkon-S.

Is that video really informative enough to warrant the cost if you don't own Gouldians? I'd love to buy it, but it's so pricey. And for some reason I thought his method involved potting soil.

[nixity]

It's expensive because much of the cost is donated back to STGF

[diinin]

Well, that's good, but they'd probably make more money if they sold it at a more affordable cost, by volume of sales. Have you seen it? Does it pertain mostly to Gouldians?

So far my frequently rinsed seed hasn't molded yet. I'm going to put it in the frig overnight and feed it in the morning.

I bought this cute little tea strainer this week, perfect for this project. The sides are very steep, like a glass, and it's small, with a very fine strainer, so no seeds can fit thru.

[debbie276]

The way Mike Fidler has you sprout, you are only leaving the seeds in the water for 1 1/2 hours 2 hours max. You drain the water for 24 hours stirring occasionally to dry them out. The seeds in his black mix take 15 - 20 hours to chit and his white mix of seeds 20 - 30 hours. It's so easy and works great!

[wellingtoncdm]

I liked the DVD. Any chance to learn is great and worth the investment.
The fact that part of the $$ is to help save Gouldians is a plus.

[nixity]

It is mostly about Gouldians, yes.

[diinin]

The way Mike Fidler has you sprout, you are only leaving the seeds in the water for 1 1/2 hours 2 hours max. You drain the water for 24 hours stirring occasionally to dry them out. The seeds in his black mix take 15 - 20 hours to chit and his white mix of seeds 20 - 30 hours. It's so easy and works great!

Wow, that's a completely different method. I'll try it. I'm probably drowning mine. A few chit really early, and then the rest not at all. I'll probably get the DVD, but not right away. I've spent a fortune trying to figure out what to feed these guys! Just gave all my Abba seed and the Harrison pellets to my parents to put in their bird feeders.