Mules and Hybrids

[BigBear0007]

We have some confusion here!
I was referring to the European Siskin ( yellow ) one.
This is for song and not for colour.

Also the Green singer, European green finch,
european goldfinch, twite, red poll, this is all for song!

I would not bother with the red Siskin,
first it's too damn expensive and too
sensitive and almost commits suicide!
Also we have the red factor already
and don't need anymore crossing for colour.

Jerry

[Bird man]

I love the European Siskin i am going to try for a hybrid this year i think they are a hardy wee bird,I also breed for song and hopefully for the bench, Going to try him with a yellow greenfinch hen I am surprised to hear they are 400 a pair you can buy a pair of C.Y.A.B for about 60 euro

[kheather]

very pretty birds.

[BigBear0007]

I love the European Siskin i am going to try for a hybrid this year i think they are a hardy wee bird,I also breed for song and hopefully for the bench, Going to try him with a yellow greenfinch hen I am surprised to hear they are 400 a pair you can buy a pair of C.Y.A.B for about 60 euro
[ http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j399/goldfinchman/df1614dc.jpg ]
[ http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j399/goldfinchman/e7c19c98.jpg ]
[ http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j399/goldfinchman/6f12aa4e.jpg ]

My friend and fellow breeder of Waterslagers has a male Siskin which he crossed with a Waterslager hen last year and got some lovely birds!
They sing really well, and are beautiful to look at!
Good luck with your pairing!

Jerry

[kenny66]

Well as a siskin fancier and breeder I think that cross breeding them to be a waste of a bird( my opinion). I breed both red and yellows and don't seem to have many issues except on the reds at around day 9 of hatching when the hen stops sitting. I have found siskins to be quite tough and robust actually and breed form late spring to early winter. I'm sorry that you keep loseing your siskins and at $400 a pair would be frustrating. I'm just sad that if cross breeding continues then the fate of the siskin as we know will be lost forever.

i totally agree-the mad and indescriminant trapping that goes on to feed the animal trade is the thing that tortures me most in life. The decimation of the Spix's Macaw is but one example of what happens when there are no controls. I can see an argument for improving bird type but siskin to canary logic eludes me. This beautiful bird will probably go extint because of canary colour preferences. On the point of difficulty in keeping in captivity, those challenging finches are what makes us improve our finch husbandry and we hopefully meet the challenge. I am dealing with two very difficult species at the moment and I think it has taken me three years to get it right.

[kathmcm]

i totally agree-the mad and indescriminant trapping that goes on to feed the animal trade is the thing that tortures me most in life.

I share your feelings exactly on this issue.

[Dayna]

Well as a siskin fancier and breeder I think that cross breeding them to be a waste of a bird( my opinion). I breed both red and yellows and don't seem to have many issues except on the reds at around day 9 of hatching when the hen stops sitting. I have found siskins to be quite tough and robust actually and breed form late spring to early winter. I'm sorry that you keep loseing your siskins and at $400 a pair would be frustrating. I'm just sad that if cross breeding continues then the fate of the siskin as we know will be lost forever.

I completely agree with this too. There are so many red factor canaries out there now they are as easy to find as society or zebra finches. There is no need what so ever to keep on trapping them for greedy people that don't give a rats butt about the species themselves. People that buy these birds to cross breed are as bad a the hunters themselves. People need to leave them alone and give them a chance to re-populate.

[BigBear0007]

Again I see that people are getting hot under the collet about mulling and hybridising birds!
Also I did not say I am advocating of breeding the red Siskin because they are so rare!
All other siskins for mules and hybrids in my eyes is fine!

[Dayna]

I was not getting angry with you Jerry. I think hybrids are fine to the point where both species are very well populated and easy to find. I was just stating my opinion that when you start messing around with species that are endangered or close to it is wrong. That goes for any type species whether its a bird, cat, elephant, whatever.

[dan78]

Bigbear, sorry to jump at your comments should have inquired a bit more as to what siskins you were using. As you can tell that I'm a bit stubborn when it comes to hybrids especially when alot of people are using the wrong birds (rare or endangered) just to get a fancy bird. As I'm led to believe the number of wild European siskins are fine. As for the wild red siskin I know numbers are dwindling due to development and trapping which in either case I doubt will stop till its to late, which my children or there children may only ever see a red siskin in captivity as the wild ones in time will be gone. Hybrid gold finch and Canary are abundant here which I don't have a problem with as both birds are abundant. Our numbers here of the purple grenadier are declining and with the import export bans we can't get any new birds to help save numbers so I have been told by people that some group of guys have got together and have crossed some purples with blue caps to get a fertile hybrid which they intend to cross back with a purple to see if they can get 90% purple grenadier, they are hoping that doing this they may be able to get numbers back so that the purple grenadier can come back to aviculture in Australia so here is another example where hybrids can be useful.