Cage bottom guidance needed

[sundancekid]

Hello! I have been lurking for quite a while and decided it's finally time to jump in! I am a newbie coming to the end of my research and almost ready to get my first pair of societies (once I can find a reputable local source). After stalking Craigslist, I finally snatched up a Prevue Hendryx 040 flight cage for $50. I've cleaned it up and have most of my accessories in place. I'm now struggling with the cage bottom. I've made a list of the aspects I'm struggling with.... sorry for the long post:

1) I am unsure whether I want/should use the grate. I was talking to a breeder online and she feels that the grates hurt their little feet. I know a lot of people put their liner/paper over the grate, but it would be easier to clean by using the slide-out pan and not having to open the cage. So should I just leave the grate out?

2) Let's assume I leave the grate out. What should I use to line the pan? The cage will be primarily in our living room, so I really want something that looks ok and definitely keeps any odor down. It seems like most people who use anything other than paper also use a grate to prevent access to litter material.

3) If I did use the grate with some sort of litter underneath in the pan, is the grate hard to clean? Does it make the cage look dirtier? Does it really hurt their feet?

Thanks in advance for feedback. I'm looking forward to getting to know the community here!

[lovezebs]

sundancekid
Hi there, and welcome to the Forum. Glad you decided to finally take the leap.

Societies, are great beginner birds, and are sweet, easy going little guys. I would recommend two males, unless you are planning on breeding or want to deal with females laying unwanted eggs.

Regarding your questions.
I guess I would have to say, that it's a personal choice.
I line my flights with newspaper and top that with paper towels, to make it more pleasent looking. I put the papers/paper towels on top of the grate. I find that easier to deal with, than scrubbing huge grates everyday. Plus, one of my flights has a grate that can't be removed.
I have tried different things, but find that most of it usually ends up on the floor as it flies out through the bars when the birds move around.
Regarding smells.
I find that if I change the papers, or at least the paper towels daily, there really is no smell to speak of. Of course you need to change water dishes and bath tubs daily, at times more often if water gets dirty. Also any eggs and fruit/ veggies, need to be removed every day, or they can get smelly pretty quickly.
If you give your perches and bars a quick wipe daily, they will never get really dirty. And If you set up a regular schedule, it becomes a daily routine which your birds will appreciate and come to expect.

Goodluck, and once again welcome.

[MiaCarter]

Welcome!
How exciting setting up your first cage!

Personally, I cover the grate whenever it's practical to do so.

The grate's primary function is to keep them separated from their feces. But if you're cleaning daily and the cage has an appropriate number of birds, then cleanliness isn't going to be a problem.
You really do need to commit to cleaning daily if you remove the grate since they will be in direct contact with their poop.

When I cover or remove the grate, i've found that they tend to spend a LOT more time on the floor, foraging around in the spilled seed and so forth. I like this; it gives them a more usable area of the cage.

It's also more efficient food-wise, as they don't lose food items that fall through the grate. This is especially true for foods like cucumber bits, egg food, peas, etc. where you have little chunks that they bite several times and toss around in the process.

I don't think it's healthy for their feet. And they don't seem to enjoy spending time on the grate. The bars are too narrow for them to comfortably grasp, and their feet are too small to comfortably span a couple of bars. If you watch them on the grate, you'll see what I mean.

[finchmix22]

Welcome to the forum! I keep the grate and cover it with paper towels, which I take out as often as they need to be changed. I don't like using just the tray, as that leave a gap in the bottom that some finches can escape through or get caught between. I would not keep the grate in without covering it with paper towels. That allows them to forage on the paper towels and it's easy for me to clean. I just roll up the paper towels, toss and lay down new ones. I like using the "pick a size" paper towels because I can fit them in without excess paper towels. Some of my finches love to pull at the paper towels for nesting material, but most of the time, they leave it alone. Either way, with or with out the grate, you'll need to watch they are not foraging in their own droppings, mixed with the fallen seeds etc. Again, cleanliness is key here.
Enjoy your finches and post pics once you set them up!

[MiaCarter]

finchmix22 -- I'm a select-a-size user too! Love them!

[Finnie]

I don't think it hurts them to forage for seed amongst their droppings. They key is that you don't want a lot of droppings to build up. So removing a layer of newspaper (or paper towel) each day or so like the others have stated is an easy way to keep poop build up to a minimum. (You are never going to have 100% poop free cage, and they know which are poops and which are seeds anyway.)

I think that the method of having a layer of bedding or litter to catch the poops, with or without the grate over it, makes it easier for someone to believe the bottom is clean enough when it isn't, because the droppings are out of sight.

If you do decide to leave the grate out, you'll have to make sure the gap isn't too big, like Deborah said. And then when you want to slide the bottom tray out, you will definitely have to slide in the grate first, or else they will have the whole bottom open for flying out of the cage!

[sundancekid]

Thanks for all the feedback! It seems like people really like to use paper, so I guess I will give that a go and just change it every day to keep odors at bay. I ordered a roll of heavy kraft paper from Walmart to try out.
I did take out the grate and move the tray up to see how big the gap would be. It's big enough that I'm a little concerned, but small enough that I think I could rig something up to fix it. When the paper gets here, I'm going to see if I could slide the grate out with the paper on top. Either way, I plan to cut a piece of cardboard to slide in while I have the tray and/or grate out for cleaning.

**Intriguing idea: I found a thread on here where someone mentioned that they use artificial turf on the tray. They said it was very easy to hose off and they had two to switch out while one was drying. There were a lot of people very intrigued by the idea, but no one else followed up and said if it worked for them too. I also thought the birds would have fun foraging in it. What do you all think of this?

Thanks!

[finchmix22]

sundancekid
All I can think of is the hard, more tough plastic lawn materials, which would probably be tough on finches feet and would poke their bellies, I think. If there a type that is not ingestable and easy to clean, it might work. I thought about using the reptile substrate that look like moss/grass, but are soft. However, I think the finches would try to pluck and eat the stuff and it could be dangerous for their digestive system, so I didn't get some this time.

[sundancekid]

finchmix22
That's what I thought of at first too and other people in the thread mentioned that. Apparently this person uses some of that higher quality stuff that feels more like real grass. The problem is that all the nicer stuff I've found only comes in big rolls ($$) that would probably cover my entire living room! I'm just going to give the paper a try since it was cheap and keep my eye out for something reusable/washable. If you do work up the nerve to try out the substrate, I would love to know how it goes!

[Decimus]

We use the grate for our zebra cage, because the little guys are utterly determined to tear it up and use it for nesting material. The paper also moves when they fly, so the grating helps keep it in position. Of course they were making such a mess we had to buy them tidy seed feeders to just reduce the seeds that ended on the floor!

[jebediah]

I took the grate out of my cage since it was hard to clean and I couldn't pull it out without completely taking the cage apart. I put a select-a-size liner down and use carefree natural bedding on top of that. My boys use it for nesting and it also does a good job of hiding the poops and keeping smells at bay. Plus carefresh comes in fun colors if you want, I find the natural is the cheapest and does the best at odor control.

[Colt]

A little late to the party, but in some of my cages I have paper on top of the grates, and in some I do not. The large single and double flights are easy to change the papers on so they go on top of the grate. Getting paper in and out of the 30x18x18 and the 24x16x16 breeding cages is really hard to do and I feel like it stresses the birds out (an me when they escape) so their paper is in the tray. I also have a cage with a very deep bottom and no grate. I use Kaytee's Crushed Walnut Litter which is sift-able and very attractive.

[Airlyn]

I don't use my grate. I cut a piece of lumber trim to slide in and it fit perfectly, so no gap.
When I clean the cages, I slide the pan out then put the grate in so no one goes flying around while I clean the pans. I think the lumber I bought is 1/2 inch by 1 inch. I can check tomorrow. All are sleeping now.
Air~