Dizzy Zebra Finch

[LindsayG]

Any news on Lucy?

Hi everyone. Here is the update. Kenny and Frankenfinch, you were right. It is, unfortunately, twirling. The vet is open on Saturdays, so I went up to see Lucy again that morning. The vet was able to talk to me at length, and she feels that Lucy is about 30% better. She does well in the morning, but when she is tired she gets worse. She does not want to give me a prognosis just yet, and I let her know that I would do whatever it took to get Lucy well, but that I did not want her to suffer. She told me that Lucy is not suffering, and she would not let her suffer. She also said that it was "tincture of time" that causes this, which is a phrase I hadn't heard before. Basically, she said that a lot of people over the years have fed Lucy's ancestors mostly seed diets, which have resulted in progressively weaker birds. I didn't know that they actually eat bugs in the wild. I told her that I've done everything the owner of the bird store has said to do (seed, egg food, grit with calcium, minerals in the water, veggies, cuttlebone), but the vet said that isn't enough nutrients. Also, she was filling up on the cucumber (mostly water) and not eating the other stuff. I ended up buying a small bag of pelleted food from her for $7 that I'm going to try to introduce to Pedro and the babies. I asked her about the Nystatin and told her that I'd heard about it here, and she had me email her the link. Apparently she started Lucy on the Nystatin on Sunday, and Lucy is still in the incubator today (at 92 degrees and 95% humidity). I called today and they said she has had no change, but they want me to give them several more days. I don't really care how long it takes if she gets better and can have a happy life. I honestly feel inspired by Lucy because she is trying so hard to get better, eating and standing up. And she actually recognized me and my voice when I saw her on Saturday. She stopped what she was doing, straightened up, looked at me and listened to me. I didn't really think she would know me. The next few days are going to be critical to her future. If she doesn't make some real progress, I'm going to have to talk to the vet and find out what she suggests. I hope I'm not going to have to deal with an ethical dilemma of life vs. death. I don't mind having a handicapped bird, but I love her too much to let her be miserable. Prayers are needed, for Lucy to get better and for me to make the right decisions for her. I greatly appreciate all of the support received from everyone here on the forum. Your kind words have provided an immeasurable amount of comfort.

[lovemyfinch]

Prayers being sent for you and Lucy

[cindy]

I hope Lucy will be ok, I also think you are doing a great job in helping her. May she return home to you soon.

I use pellets and have been putting it in with the seed, what I am thinking of doing is usung primarily pellets and giving them seed in a smaller amount. When I go to clean the dishes out most of the cage have the pellets powdered and seed untouched, there are exception my Continental CFW like the big white millet and that goes first in there cage....There are sites where it can be shipped to you in bigger quanities like 5 lb and 10 lb bags that you can not get in the stores, it is cheaper to. The stores sell such little bags for so much money...

http://www.bulkbirdfood.com/
http://www.foryourbird.com/mm5/merchant.mvc

I've tried many kinds and flavors and mine love the Zupreem fruit blend finch and canary.

[lou]

Lindsay,
Sorry to here your birdie is still the same.
Is the vet doing this out of the kindness of her/his heart? In other words free of charge?
Lou

[L in Ontario]

Lindsay,
Is the vet doing this out of the kindness of her/his heart? In other words free of charge?
Lou

I wanted to ask the same thing but didn't know how. That is a long time Lucy is under the vet's care.

I gave my daughter a Cut-throat hen I had that was twirling when I got her. There has been no change with this hen over the year. But there is no real reason to put her down either. Best wishes for Lucy!

[LindsayG]

Lindsay,
Sorry to here your birdie is still the same.
Is the vet doing this out of the kindness of her/his heart? In other words free of charge?
Lou

No, I don't have any assumptions that it is free of charge. The town the vet is in is a poor one, and she mentioned to me the first time I came in that people can't always afford to go to the vet with their pets in my town. This is true--Santa Fe is really expensive for EVERYTHING. On Saturday I told the tech that I wanted to make a payment. She said that there wasn't a bill yet, but I could pay $50.00 if I wanted. I offered to pay $100.00, but she said that I should just pay $50.00 for now. I'm not too concerned at this point. I'm not wealthy, just doing slightly better than scraping by, but I'll manage it somehow. Lucy is a real sweetheart, and my husband and I miss her a lot. Has anyone had any successes/failures with Nystatin? Can birds with twirling get better enough to perch and be with another bird, and still live happy lives, even if they are somewhat handicapped? I don't know where to draw the line between her illness and her desire to live. Obviously she won't be raising babies again if she gets better, and her babies won't be, either. They are staying with me so that I can ensure this particular line stops here.

[LindsayG]

Lindsay,
Is the vet doing this out of the kindness of her/his heart? In other words free of charge?
Lou

I wanted to ask the same thing but didn't know how. That is a long time Lucy is under the vet's care.

I gave my daughter a Cut-throat hen I had that was twirling when I got her. There has been no change with this hen over the year. But there is no real reason to put her down either. Best wishes for Lucy!

How bad is the twirling in your daughter's Cut-throat hen? Lucy's head is twisted quite a bit, but still stands and still eats. She doesn't seem as dizzy as before. Do you notice times where she is worse, like when tired, or better, when well-rested? Do other birds pick on her at all?

[LindsayG]

I hope Lucy will be ok, I also think you are doing a great job in helping her. May she return home to you soon.

I use pellets and have been putting it in with the seed, what I am thinking of doing is usung primarily pellets and giving them seed in a smaller amount. When I go to clean the dishes out most of the cage have the pellets powdered and seed untouched, there are exception my Continental CFW like the big white millet and that goes first in there cage....There are sites where it can be shipped to you in bigger quanities like 5 lb and 10 lb bags that you can not get in the stores, it is cheaper to. The stores sell such little bags for so much money...

http://www.bulkbirdfood.com/
http://www.foryourbird.com/mm5/merchant.mvc

I've tried many kinds and flavors and mine love the Zupreem fruit blend finch and canary.

Thanks, Cindy. That's what the vet told me to do, was to eventually make the pellets the primary food, with seeds and veggies as treats. I'm hoping I can get my birds to eat them. Today is the first day of pellets mixed in with seed and with egg bread, so I'm crossing my fingers. I'll have to try the Zupreem, too. I can't remember what brand I bought from the vet. It's small pellets, but she said to grind it in a coffee grinder at first. Do your birds eat it whole, or ground?

[cindy]

My zebra and owls love Zupreme, they are ever so tiny (seed size) there is no need to grind. I either add it to the seed or in a separate cup depending on the finches. Eventually their diet will be more of the pellets since some are ignoring most of the seed, seed will be provided but scalled down, most ends up in the tray. The left over powder from the eaten pellets can be added to eggfood or if you bake it can be added to birdie bread.

I tried all the other pellets and they really like the fruit blend Zupreem, some even have favorite colors they like best. It is funny to see just the green and yellow left, or to have them pick out just the orange.

I grind them and add it to Higgins ProTeeen 25 Eggfood (grind this also). They also like Miracle Meal, ABBA92 eggfood with greens.

For Miracle meal I order from a few different vendors but the ABBA92 I get from Bird Supply NH. The ProTeen 25 from a firend of the bulk places in the addresses above.

When getting new finches home I give them the pellets and seed, they all go to the pellets and down them, i can usually tell if the birds are either starving or never had pellets and really like them.

[lou]

Lindsay,
Bring your little birdie home. I have used nystatin (liquid) it works if the prob. is caught on time. the problem is that a bird with twirling is that most end up going to the big aviary in the sky, they usually starve to death do to their condition. You can do everything that the vet is doing yourself. Lindsay, this condition is not caused by feeding seed for generations to birds.
Lou

[cindy]

This article is extremely good...read the summary at the end, I believe the vet is saying the same thing...to much seed, poor diet contributes to the condition along with stress and being predisposed can contribute to certain illnesses/conditions. Seed alone is not a good diet for these little creatures.

Hope this helps...http://www.ladygouldianfinch.com/features_twirling.mgi

My thoughts are with you and your little Lucy. May she continue to improve.

The one drug the author recommends is SMZ Liquid or Trimethoprim Sulfa. This may be a injury to the inner ear.

[6finchfriends]

I am that little Lucy is improving! You are not being silly at all and I think your boss is insensitive. We all love our pets, feathers, hair, scales, we love them all. If she's rubbing her ear I'm also wondering if it isn't inner ear infection. My friend had one once and she couldn't stand up! I'll be sending out good karma for your little Lucygirl! Get well soon!!

[kenny]

my wife suffers from meniers syndrome and it affects the inner ear,she has learnt to live with it over the years but when she first got it she could only stand up if she put her head on one side and she was constantly being sick she still goes dizzy occasionally but when she first got it she hit the floor like a drunken man and i had to take time off work to look after our 2 kids because there was no way she could do it.....the thing i am getting to is there was no cure she was examined over and over ,but she never ever got any medication for it and they just said she would have to learn to live with it!


ken

[LindsayG]

Lindsay,
Bring your little birdie home. I have used nystatin (liquid) it works if the prob. is caught on time. the problem is that a bird with twirling is that most end up going to the big aviary in the sky, they usually starve to death do to their condition. You can do everything that the vet is doing yourself. Lindsay, this condition is not caused by feeding seed for generations to birds.
Lou

Okay. What do you think does cause it? It seems like there are a lot of theories, but no agreed-upon conclusions on this particular disease. Also a lot of ideas on what to feed them. I'm getting frustrated because I thought these were hardy birds, and easy to care for. The more I research what the proper diet should be, I see that every website has a different opinion, each one more complicated. The bird store always tells me something new that they didn't tell me before. I just want to take care of them properly, but I don't really know what that is anymore.

[LindsayG]

my wife suffers from meniers syndrome and it affects the inner ear,she has learnt to live with it over the years but when she first got it she could only stand up if she put her head on one side and she was constantly being sick she still goes dizzy occasionally but when she first got it she hit the floor like a drunken man and i had to take time off work to look after our 2 kids because there was no way she could do it.....the thing i am getting to is there was no cure she was examined over and over ,but she never ever got any medication for it and they just said she would have to learn to live with it!


ken

Wow, I'm sorry to hear your wife has had to go through that, but I'm glad she has learned to cope. It sounds miserable.