confusing green singer behaviour!

[can]

Hi - my pretty little female green singer named Lacey started acting strange yesterday.

Background history: She is 3 yrs. old or older. About a year and a half ago, I made the mistake of placing nests in my cages, which caused some cute behaviour in my other finches, but also brought about Lacey and her mate Rothko having Jamoke. The day after Jamoke fledged, Lacey (who was still feeding Jamoke) began laying more eggs, and became egg-bound. Well after an emergency visit to the vet's and an all nighter, Lacey pasted her egg and she's been fine ever since. There have not been nests in the cage since.

Lacey is currently housed in a flight cage with a pair of cutthroats and zebras, and a single parrot finch and her mate. Rothko and her have always been housed with other finches. I have not had any serious issues with aggression in the cage (plucking, fighting, birds not being able to feed, etc.)

Rothko and Lacey often feed each other and kiss.

Strange behaviour: Yesterday, Lacey started perching on the rope in her cage. The rope is about an inch thick and twists along the back of the cage. She has been sitting in the curve of one of the lower twists. She fluffs up, spreads her feet far apart and flattens her body down as much as she can - like she would if she was in a nest. She is still eating a little, I've placed a small food cup by her. And is drinking. I dip my finger in water and she will drink the water off my finger. The only other time she has done this is when she was egg bound.

She can still fly. And when she is made to leave the area, she sings, is active, not fluffed up, etc. Last night she actually slept in the swing in the cage, but then returned to rope.

Yesterday, I moved her into a separate cage with a nest, hoping that if she is egg bound she would settle in the quieter cage and lay her egg. After two hours of her not settling, hopping around and hanging off of the sides of the cage, I returned her to her cage. I cannot place a nest in her current cage, due to the zebra and cutthroat pair.

She has been receiving vitamins in her water since yesterday morning. The vitamin power does seem to have calcium in it. The room she is in has been quite warm both today and yesterday.

Sorry, for the long message. If anyone has any suggestions, it would be greatly appreciated.

Candace.

[finchmix22]

She sounds like she could be eggbound. Can you put her in a small cage alone with heat and a moist towel draped around the sides of the cage. The lamp should be over the cage and one side left open so she can get away from the heat is she wants. I use my small, guest bathroom, as that works well to keep in the heat from the lamp and sometimes, I run the hot water in the shower to add humidity, which helps with egg binding. If you do not have access to Calcium Plus or your vet can't give you a small bottle of Calcium Glutonate to give to her by beak, then give her hardboiled eggs crushed up with shells or lightly chopped in a food processor (not too much or it gets sticky and they won't eat it). Either way, the heat, moisture, and calcium from the eggs will help her pass the egg.

[can]

Oh, I should add: She is still pooing, so I think that indicates she's not egg bound. I have held her and felt her bottom, and I think everything is well down there.

Thanks for the reply, but I did put her in a separate cage yesterday and it seemed to stress her out more. She didn't settle once in two hours, hopped around, etc. The room she is in very warm. I don't know how the humidity is, but I am hand feeding her water every hour.

[finchmix22]

Very warm? What temp is the room at? When my finches are sick or not up to par, they want to sit directly under a heat lamp/bulb. My finch room averages a temp between 77-87. They still sit under the lamp when it gets up to the 80's, so she may want one anyway. That way, they don't use all their energy to keep warm.

[can]

They also get egg food regularly. However, I will give them more today.

If I have to, I will take her to the avian vet, however since I've never gone there before they won't give me any medication for my birds without an appointment. The vet I took her to before was an emergency vet and not an avian vet, so I won't take her back to them. But even they won't give me anything because them haven't seem her in over a year.

Last time she was egg bound, she could not fly or move around. For now, she is still flying and is active. She flies away when I try to pick her up, and she is still flying well. Although, she seems to prefer squatting on the rope.

The room is very warm . We have hot water heating in the apartment and cannot control our heat. In the rest of the apartment the doors and windows are kept open, and although Toronto isn't very cold this winter, it is still winter.

I have a feeling this is more behavioural, she is nesting, then her actually being sick.

[can]

I did feed them egg food today, and Lacey ate some when I held it up to her. I am fairly sure Rothko is also feeding her too. I also put a wet blanket on the hot water heater to increase humidity.

[cindy]

Can you attach the heat lamp to the outside of the cage near were she sits. It is vital she is kept warm...if she is egg bound the heat will help her relax the muscles to lay the egg.

Extra humidity is great but if the room gets to damp she will get chilled...this is what I would do keep her in the cage she is comfortable in, get the heat lamp on her and make sure she has a water cup near where she sits.

Instead of a wet blanket try a pot of water on or next to the heater.

[can]

Thanks Cindy!

I don't really have a heat lamp, but even if I did, considering where Lacey has planted herself, she would be to far away. As things are now, the hot water rad is right beside the cage and giving off a lot of heat. We regularly keep a pan of water on the rad for humidity in the winter, and I've placed a wet towel on it for extra humidity. I do have FS fluorescent lights above the cage, but it doesn't provide any heat. (Last time Lacey was egg bound, I set up a hospital cage using my husband's desk light and heated a towel that I changed every hour - it was a long night. But you could tell she was in pain, and she wasn't active and could not fly.)

But I am wondering if she is egg bound or just nesting?

If a bird is egg bound can they still poo?
Lacey is still pooing, and very large poos indeed. Like when GS female poo when they are sitting on eggs. They won't poo in the nest, so they store it up and have one very big one.

She is still active - when she is forced to leave her perch, she flies very well. She is also still eating and drinking.

I've tried feeling her bottom area - but I don't really know what I'm feeling for. Can anyone help me with that?

If she is nesting, how do I stop her, or indicate to her that it's not a good time to nest - before an emergency occurs? The avian vet in TO is $75 to get in the front door (compare $48 for my regular cat vet). We also just spent $300 last month at my cat's vet dealing with a bladder infection. I will take Lacey in if I need to, but the last time it cost $300. So if I can solve the problem on my own, that would be nice.

Should I remove the rope from the cage (as it seems to be her preferred nesting place)?

I don't have Calcium Plus, but she received egg food w/shells last Friday and yesterday. Plus there is calcium in the vitamins I have been adding to her water since Sunday. I've also been sprinkling oyster shells on her seeds. They have a cuttle bone in the cage, and in the past I've regularly seen Lacey eating it.