Society Finch genetics!

[the.puppeteer]

Aren't genetics fun?

Ok, so to start we bred a male fawn self (with minial white under the beak) with a female chocolate pied double crested (split for the crest as the outcome of this cross gave away).

The offspring consists of 4 chicks. Three are chocolate pied double crested (as expected), and one is chocolate self.

My real questions are:

-is pied a dominant gene? And if so this would mean that our female is split for pied, correct?
-are all of the chicks split for fawn?
-are the crested chicks split for crested or are they 'full' crested (is there a way of telling without breeding them)?
- same question but replace 'crest' with 'pied' lol.

I had more questions but I think I either answered them in my head or forgot them lol.

Here are some pics!

[FeatherHarp]

I sure don't know anything about genetics but just had to say your crested look so neat!

[hilljack13]

Well now aren't they just the darn cutest little boogers you ever saw!

[BillD]

I just became the proud 'papa' of 2 Chocolate Society finches today. They are settling in quite well tonight.

The Female has possible split to fawn and chestnut. The male has possible split to creamieno? and fawn.

Know I'm lucky to have this information, but what should I know for the future? It has been a long time since I learned about Mendel's genetic models. hehe..

I would appreciate where I might find a description of all the mutations for Society's .

I'm a database guy (geek), so information is what I seek.

The animals and birds always come first though, so don't worry.

[BillD]

Looks like my questions will have some answers in the future.

http://www.finchinfo.com/genetics/index.php

the.puppeteer: Not sure if you've seen this already. Lady Gouldians have had a long history of genetic history, but it looks as if we may have some info on Bengalese coming in the future.

[Steven]

They look great

[dragon]

-is pied a dominant gene? And if so this would mean that our female is split for pied, correct?


When you say "dominant", you need to specify 'dominant to what'

A.
If pied were dominant to non pied, then a split (single factor) bird and a pied (double factor) bird would look the same.
In that case, your female could not be split for pied as she would look pied.

To test this, breed:

Double factor pied (a bird bred from only pieds for several generations is likely to be double factor) x Non pied (A bird bred for several generations from birds never producing a pied is likely to be non pied)
All young will be split pied (single factor). If all young are pied, then pied is dominant to non pied.

B.
If pied were recessive to non pied, the pied gene would need to be present as double factor to be visible and your female would have to be split for pied, or the pair would not have been able to produce double factor pied birds.

C.
Unfortunately there is also such a thing as partial dominance, where pied is dominant over non pied only when another (?) gene is present.
So the whole thing is too complicated.

-are all of the chicks split for fawn?

Assuming that fawn is a sex-linked recessive to normal, only the males are split.

-are the crested chicks split for crested or are they 'full' crested (is there a way of telling without breeding them)?

In budgerigars, crested has a complex inheritance:
(I seem to be unable to post the Link, so just Google Crested Budgerigars for the article.)
This inheritance is too complex for me.
I assume it is just as complex in finches.

[Christopher Smith]

Fawn is not sex linked. A fawn to a chocolate breeding will produce visual chocolates, carrying the fawn gene.

Crest are co-dominate. If you breed a crest to a normal you will get 50% crested offspring. There are is no such thing as split to crested. If a bird carries the crested gene it will have a crest.

Pied acts as a dominate gene. There is no split to pied. A bird can’t be split to a dominate gene.

[L in Ontario]

Thanks Christopher - even I almost got that! I feel like I'm right on the verge (or edge of a cliff) of understanding it.

[jamezyboo21]

I just had my first society chick fledge 2 days ago, im so excited something else besides zebras.

[BillD]

Congratulations! Jamezyboo21