How contagious are the air sac mites?

[meve]

Hi
I'm really new in finches. I have more experience with parrots. SO there is my story: I just got 2 babies gouldians finches. I realised they were not feeling well (puffy, can't fly, clicking sound). I treated them with SCATT. They improved alot.

My question now: can I carry the mites to my parrots through my clothes just by cleaning the finches cage? The finches cage is in my bedroom, in 'quarantine' and they are the last one to have their things cleaned. My parrots don't go even close to the bedroom and I try my best not to touch my parrots after been close to the finches cage. I'm getting really paranoid! I have 10 parrots, I don't want them to get that stuff!

Plus I noticed that Finches people treat theirs birds themselves most of the time. WHy is that? Why don't they go see avian vets?

thanks for you help

[TheWhiteFinchAviary]

I'm sorry you're going through this with your flock!! Luckily you caught it in time for everyone to heal fully.

Air sac mites are HIGHLY communicable and are spread through touch, food/water sources, nesting materials, anything that they brush up against or even pick up may be used to spread the infestation. The answer to your first question is yes, you can spread the illness by touching an infested cage with your clothes. Quarantine only works if you regularly clean the cage and anything that you touch inside of it including food cups or drinkers - especially your hands/clothes after touching anything infected. Parrots are also susceptible to the mites and most things that also afflict Finches.
http://www.ladygouldianfinch.com/featur ... cmites.php

This is why people will take such great care in removing them by sanitizing everything and spraying bird-safe insect spray. That coupled with the Scatt treatment is the only way to beat it. Think bed bugs but with Finches it's inside of their lungs.

You also will need some source of nutrients to replenish what's being lost during their sickness, such as NV Powder or Quik Gel. Herb Salad can also help provide a boost and LGF recommends adding it to all Air sac treatments.

As for the reason why Finch hobbyists don't take their birds to the vet regularly, there are a couple of answers. The first is that it can actually be traumatic for them. They're not parrots. They don't do car rides or trips outside. If they get cold, a breeze could give them a respiratory infection.

The second reason is that most Finch owners don't have hundreds of dollars to spend on a bird that probably cost them $20. Bird owners in general are stereotypically not the richest of people (though that statistic is changing rapidly). I've told some owners that they need to take their Finch to the vet before and a few literally laughed in my face.

This doesn't mean that we don't go to vets ever. It does mean however that the majority will not bring their Finches in unless need be in order to keep their flock safe. Something serious like a leg break would require a vet visit.

[cindy]

With bringing new birds into the house and also tending to your established birds....rule of thumb our avian vet told me years ago....always go to your established flock first, clean and your new birds last.

[monotwine]

Good advice Cindy

Meve: I don't keep parrots, but would Scatt do any harm to them? Why not just give them a preventative treatment. I treat all my birds for external parasites every quarter regardless. That way you can be sure they do not have any parasites.

As to the vet story. Others have answered too. Many of us do use avian vets, and through pure experience now can manage their medication by ourselves, unless it is beyond us. Many of the problems / treatments are simple and the medication is easily available or required routinely. The trip to a vet is traumatic and the very small birds delicate enough to die from the stress alone.
However it will always be encouraged to see a vet if you are not experienced.
Another problem often encountered is vets that are not too familiar with birds. I live in a town with 5 veterinary practices. None are avian vets. Luckily one is a finch breeder himself, so I trust his judgement call on my birds.

[Sally]

I wouldn't worry so much about it. If you want to SCATT your parrots, it certainly isn't going to hurt them. My personal opinion is that air sac mites aren't nearly as common as people think. Whenever they think their birds have a breathing problem or they think they hear clicking sounds, they assume air sac mites, but often it is a respiratory infection instead. Since Gouldians are one of the species most susceptible to air sac mites, then it probably is a good idea to have a regular schedule of SCATT, but as far as spraying your cages, bird room, etc., I wouldn't bother. Most bird-safe sprays are permethrin-based and aimed at external mites. Air sac mites are internal mites and moxidectin is the best product to use on them. I've only heard of using a product like SCATT or S76 on the birds or in their water, never on the cages/cups/etc.

As far as why finch owners don't often use avian vets, most avian vets don't see many finch patients. Economically, many owners of say a $10 Zebra finch can't justify spending $100+ in vet bills. When a finch dies, a necropsy may cost several hundred dollars, and then you get a report of 'cause of death undetermined.' Very frustrating.

[lou]

Amen to that Cindy
lou

[cindy]

Good advice Cindy

Meve: I don't keep parrots, but would Scatt do any harm to them? Why not just give them a preventative treatment. I treat all my birds for external parasites every quarter regardless. That way you can be sure they do not have any parasites.

As to the vet story. Others have answered too. Many of us do use avian vets, and through pure experience now can manage their medication by ourselves, unless it is beyond us. Many of the problems / treatments are simple and the medication is easily available or required routinely. The trip to a vet is traumatic and the very small birds delicate enough to die from the stress alone.
However it will always be encouraged to see a vet if you are not experienced.
Another problem often encountered is vets that are not too familiar with birds. I live in a town with 5 veterinary practices. None are avian vets. Luckily one is a finch breeder himself, so I trust his judgement call on my birds.

We have several outstanding avian vets in our area...two of which I use, one our daughter works with. She has been extremely helpful when there is even the slightest of concern regarding both finches and hookbills.

The trouble with finches is they often do not show/mask the illness until it is sometimes to far into the issue, often there is not much that can be done in some cases but supportive care. They have come a long way in medications and things we can use to treat at home as Monique mentioned. It is good to find a vet you trust and are confident in.

[cindy]

http://www.officialbarrieshuttbudgeriga ... cmites.htm
http://www.beautyofbirds.com/airsackmites.html

A couple of helpful articles on ASM

[meve]

Wow thanks for all these answers !
Please forgive my spelling and grammar as my first language is French ;)

I have read most of the articles already in my past researches. I found it really confusing... nobody says the same about how to use SCATT on the birds (where to put it), some say to treat every week for 3 weeks, others say to treat again in 3 weeks.

About the quarantine, I do already what you said :'Quarantine only works if you regularly clean the cage and anything that you touch inside of it including food cups or drinkers - especially your hands/clothes after touching anything infected' and 'always go to your established flock first, clean and your new birds last.' But what do you suggest to use for cleaning the water bowl and food? Actually, I use boiled water with vinagar.

For my parrots, I have to go see the vet next week for a follow up with one of my parrot. I will ask her what to do exactly. If I hear any sneezing or puffy birds , I 'll use SCATT or maybe I will use it anyway before to see the vet. I'm confused. I don't want to make a fatal mistake.

Finally, thanks for your answers about the vet. I understand that finches are fragile and that a trip in car could make it worse for them. I don't undersand, or let say I disagree, that a $10 finch doesn't worth $100 vet fee. It's a life, never mind how much you paid for it...I spent as much money on my budgies than on my more expensive parrots...but it's only my opinion ;)

So tell me: when do I treat again my babies? After one week or 3 ?
What can I use to clean their bowls?
How long do I have to give them Thrive?

thanks!

[cindy]

I asked my vet about parasites and hookbills, she said it is rare hookbills have them. Regarding the parrots....if you suspect sneezing, puffy birds, discharge from the nostrils, loss of appetite it is best to take them straight to the vet and let him/her do a gram study, throat swab and possibly bloodwork, diagnostic work. I do not fool around with the larger birds and medicating them myself, I let the vet tell me what is wrong. There are to many other things than ASM that can cause these symptoms.

I have finches and a variety of hookbills and never used scatt on my hookbills.

[30 Seconds to Bob]

Plus I noticed that Finches people treat theirs birds themselves most of the time. WHy is that? Why don't they go see avian vets?

I agree with white finch aviary on this one. Once tiny finches show visible signs of illness, they are often so seriously ill that a car ride to the vet is stressful enough to push them over the edge. Heat, vitamins and antibiotics often work wonders without the added stress.
Just for the record, the two sick canaries and one sick lovebird that I brought in to see an avian vet, all died within a few days - hundreds of dollars spent. Of the four I treated at home, three recovered. I like those odds better. It's not even so much the ridiculous amount of money as it is the results. My avian vet even told me that with the little ones, a vet visit is 50/50 at best and with illness, I'm sometimes better off treating at home. Injuries are a different story. Bob

[meve]

Thanks again

Special thanks to Cindy. I'm glad to get advice from someone who has finches and hookbills.

[cindy]

Anytime