Where have all the Java's gone?

[Tweet]

It is my understanding that the law concerning shipping over state borders was just recently added.

Where did you hear this? I researched and found that the Javas were put on the list in 1968 and I've been thinking that maybe a law that archaic could be changed. But if what you're saying it right, I don't feel optimistic about getting it reformed. I really scratch my head about this law. First, what does prohibiting crossing state lines protect if the two states involved don't have bans on Javas in the first place? And as for the northern states - does anyone really think these finches could winter over? I don't see them migrating anytime soon either, but I suppose it could happen if enough of them got loose.

Here is the Injurious Species Listings Under the Lacey Act. On page 20 you'll see the listing for Javas.

[w.l.]

I have just seen new cagefulS of beautiful adult wild-caught Javas on the market here.

Plus, a much rarer happening, there were also some Timor Sparrows!
Maybe you Ameticans should get those - very similar to Javas, but not deemed 'injurious' by your country!

[Tweet]

I have just seen new cagefulS of beautiful adult wild-caught Javas on the market here.

Plus, a much rarer happening, there were also some Timor Sparrows!
Maybe you Ameticans should get those - very similar to Javas, but not deemed 'injurious' by your country!

That's funny! I'd love to have a Timor, but it might be hard to convince the government that it isn't a Java I'm transporting across the country though!

[w.l.]

That's funny! I'd love to have a Timor, but it might be hard to convince the government that it isn't a Java I'm transporting across the country though!

One would have to be color blind not to see the difference!
Where Javas are light grey, Timors are dark brown.
See my profile pic.
Otherwise the same shape and pattern.

[wildbird]

They're probably already banned, as I have never seen them at any bird fairs. I read the information about the Java laws on this forum. About two or three years ago Cindy posted the information, and I think there was a link to the law. The latest law was one concerning bringing reptiles across state lines, and they also added the Javas. You should be able to find some information on it if you check a website for the fish and game commission in your state. I believe that Javas are listed as "endangered" in their native country.

[w.l.]

I believe that Javas are listed as "endangered" in their native country.

No, there are no "endangered" listings in Indonesia.
There is a list of protected species, including many birds, but it includes no finches whatsoever. The list is quite random, and I personally think both the Java and Timor Sparrow should be on it. Unfortunately, even officially protected species are often still freely traded within the country anyway.

Birdlife lists the Java Sparrow as vulnerable, one step away from being endangered:
http://datazone.birdlife.org/species/factsheet/22719912

As for the Timor Sparrow, it is not on the "injurious" list.
Its disappearance from the US aviculture scene seems simply the result, as in the case of many species, the lack of serious efforts to breed it when it was still available from imports.
I only suggested getting it instead of Javas as a joke - it must be either very hard or impossible to find in the US these days. This was already discussed briefly here:
http://www.finchforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=32909

[wildbird]

Tweet, the information I got was from October 25, 2013, Species, in this forum.

[Sally]

The Lacey Act certainly has an effect on breeders in the U.S. When you can't exchange bloodlines with breeders in other states, pretty soon you decide to move on to species that can cross state lines.

Javas were listed in that act back in 1967.
So why have they become scarce just recently?

I don't know why, except that I think it may be that people were really ignoring the Lacey Act or were unaware of it, and so they were freely shipping across state lines (except for those states that don't allow Javas within their borders at all). There has been more publicity in recent years, so maybe people are being a bit more careful. I did some research, and did find that if caught, you can get 6 months in prison and a $5,000 fine. That's enough to keep me honest!!

Here is some of the explanation of why Javas (or any species) are on the list:

Species are added to the list of injurious wildlife to prevent their introduction or establishment through human movement in the United States to protect the health and welfare of humans,the interests of agriculture, horticulture or forestry, and the welfare and survival of wildlife resources from potential and actual negative impacts.

[Tweet]

I FOUND SOME JAVAS!!!!
I'm going to look at them Friday and they're only about and hour 1/2 away, and in my state!

Now, I'm not sure about the woman who got them, I met her at a bird fair and she just called last night. She breeds cockatiels and it seems she doesn't know much about Javas. I told her I was looking for silver and fawn. She said she had Silver, but no Fawn only Isabel (which is the same thing as fawn, just a different name.) She didn't know if they are male or female and was going to sit with them in the mornings for then next few days and see which ones sing. Risky, but between that and me looking at beaks, etc., maybe I can come up with a cock and a hen!

I'm beyond excited!

[wildbird]

You're very lucky to find such nice colors! I believe the Isabel is different than the fawn, lighter color, and usually sells for more. They are both beautiful birds. Your Java hen will be happy too! Post some pictures. Hope you get a nice pair!

[w.l.]

Congrats!

Hope it works out fine this time.
How many are you getting?
You still need to find wild colors though!

Males may not sing a lot and a quiet male might be mistaken for a hen based on this, so do look at those bills closely. The difference tends to be pretty obvious, at least when comparing several birds.

[lovezebs]

@Tweet
Congratulations!
I am so happy for you.

I would grab several if possible, to make sure you end up with males and females.

[Babs _Owner]

Tweet

Congrats!! Fantastic news!

[Tweet]

Thank you all! I am still so excited to get there to see them.
I plan on coming home with a hen and a cock. Thankfully my funds are limited so I should be able to stick to that!

@wildbird
I've read several places that Fawn is also known as Isabel or Brown.
Java Sparrow Color Mutations
Java Colors
I'm sure there's contradictory info on color out there, there always is on just about every topic! Getting started breeding Javas might prove confusing on the color genetics.

[Tweet]

w.l.
I agree on the normal wild color. Love them! Breeding Fawn to Silver should produce normals that are split to fawn and silver.
Basic Java Color Genetics And what I do with them from there will determine the future colors of the birds. I think so anyway! I can see many nights of "light" reading ahead of me!